Category: Hypersomnia

Room For Rent

Question:

"Randall Bart" <Barti…@att.spam.net> wrote in message

news:5oh0o0ts0kl1lqst24cue2gdvc2ljkp0ku@4ax.com… > Room for rent in East Village.  Kinda small but tall with a lofted space > for queen size bed.  $450 per month + 1 month dep.  Gas/heat, A/C > included, washer/dryer.  You must have proof of regular income and a note > from your doctor which states that you suffer from either None or All of > the following (exeptions for those with an uplifting explaination of > recovery process): >     * Acute Stress Disorder >     * Acute Widdlewabbit

I had two of these, and the disorder really spread. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->     * Adjustment Disorder >     * Agoraphobia >     * Alcohol Addiction >     * Amnestic Disorder >     * Antisocial Personal Disorder >     * Anxiety Disorder NOS >     * Avoidant Personality Disorder >     * Bipolar Disorder >     * Body Dysmorphic Disorder >     * Borderline Personality Disorder >     * Brief Psychotic Disorder >     * Cognitive Disorder NOS >     * Conduct Disorder >     * Cyclothymic Disorder >     * Delerium >     * Delusional Disorder >     * Dementia >     * Dependent Personality Disorder >     * Depersonalization Disorder >     * Depressive Disorder NOS >     * Disruptive Behavior Disorder NOS >     * Dissociative Amnesia >     * Dissociative Disorder NOS >     * Dissociative Fugue >     * Dissociative Identity Disorder >     * Drug Addiction >     * Dyssomnia NOS >     * Dysthymic Disorder >     * Factitious Disorder >     * Gambling Addiction >     * Gender Identity Disorder >     * Generalized Anxiety Disorder >     * Hallucinogen Persisting Perception Disorder >     * Histrionic Personality Disorder >     * Huntington’s Disease >     * Hypersomnia >     * Hypochondriasis >     * Impulse-Control Disorder NOS >     * Intermittent Explosive Disorder >     * Kleptomania >     * Malingering >     * Mixed-Receptive-Expressive Language Disorder >     * Munchausen by Proxy >     * Munchausen Syndrome >     * Narcissistic Personality Disorder >     * Obsessive-Compulsive Personality Disorder >     * Oppositional Defiant Disorder >     * Panic Disorder >     * Paranoid Personality Disorder >     * Paraphilias >     * Parasomnia NOS >     * Premenstrual Dysphoric Disorder >     * Pyromania >     * Psytranciphobia >     * Reactive Attachment Disorder >     * Rett’s Disorder >     * Schizoaffective Disorder >     * Schizoid Personality Disorder >     * Schizophrenia >     * Schizotypal Personality Disorder >     * Seasonal Affective Disorder >     * Selective Mutism >     * Separation Anxiety Disorder >     * Shared Psychotic Disorder >     * Sleep Terror Disorder >     * Social Anxiety Disorder >     * Somatization Disorder >     * Somatoform Disorder NOS >     * Specific Phobia >     * Trichotillomania >     * Undifferentiated Somatoform Disorder > — > RB |  

Bi polar 2? what is it?

Question:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I have bipolar type 2 and I am not delusional or psychotic.    Oh Lucky you :) I have had the pleasure of experiencing delusions psychosis, hallucinations, paranoia, the whole ball of wax… It is very frightening and something I wouldn’t wish upon anyone..    Take care,   Vicky hi,everybody…..I am acquainted with people who are diagnosed "2".With no intention of offense,a few acted like like,"you’re "mentally ill",the severity of their symptoms not being as ,shall we say,bizarre or disabling.Snobbery in mental illness?never?CS/I have witnessed Bipolars,speaking of schizophrenics, acting like "I got (just a) mood disorder,not a thought disorder."What’s the point of comparison?How much good does it do?The DSM 4 ain’t The Bible,since it gets revised often enough to tell you how much we must have to know yet.C We all know some inflexible people,intolerant of ambiguity.that’s not really important to me.Those dx bipolar II don’t have such a great time,most i know spending lives battling severe depression.they say they have had little of the highs,sometimes wistfully,and i tell them they’re missing a lot of aggravation,& yes ,delusions,even hallucinations.Comparison is lost time.we oughta be getting better,or good as we can get,or well.That would be     nice,wouldn’t it?(i had to hace "closure")HHH

    Yes it would harry…. I feel I have gotten better in the long run, but my ways are unconventional. The road less traveled…       Vicky

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I have bipolar type 2 and I am not delusional or psychotic.    Oh Lucky you :) I have had the pleasure of experiencing delusions psychosis, hallucinations, paranoia, the whole ball of wax… It is very frightening and something I wouldn’t wish upon anyone..    Take care,   Vicky hi,everybody…..I am acquainted with people who are diagnosed "2".With no intention of offense,a few acted like like,"you’re "mentally ill",the severity of their symptoms not being as ,shall we say,bizarre or disabling.Snobbery in mental illness?never?CS/I have witnessed Bipolars,speaking of schizophrenics, acting like "I got (just a) mood disorder,not a thought disorder."What’s the point of comparison?How much good does it do?The DSM 4 ain’t The Bible,since it gets revised often enough to tell you how much we must have to know yet.C We all know some inflexible people,intolerant of ambiguity.that’s not really important to me.Those dx bipolar II don’t have such a great time,most i know spending lives battling severe depression.they say they have had little of the highs,sometimes wistfully,and i tell them they’re missing a lot of aggravation,& yes ,delusions,even hallucinations.Comparison is lost time.we oughta be getting better,or good as we can get,or well.That would be     nice,wouldn’t it?(i had to hace "closure")HHH     Yes it would harry…. I feel I have gotten better in the long run, but my ways are unconventional. The road less traveled…       Vicky

     Well,I am more "experienced",as Jimi Hendrix might have said,not from drugs like Jimi took,but from this I was given or became,till I’m who I am.These "illnesses" I think are not so measurable,not well defined.The differences between "disorders" who can distinguish?Not me.We just live,if that’s what we choose to do,the best we can,or we don’t try too hard.A doctor told me,shaking his head,"there is method to this madness".He quit practicing shortly thereafter,he being a psychoanalyst.C

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I have bipolar type 2 and I am not delusional or psychotic.    Oh Lucky you :) I have had the pleasure of experiencing delusions psychosis, hallucinations, paranoia, the whole ball of wax… It is very frightening and something I wouldn’t wish upon anyone..    Take care,   Vicky hi,everybody…..I am acquainted with people who are diagnosed "2".With no intention of offense,a few acted like like,"you’re "mentally ill",the severity of their symptoms not being as ,shall we say,bizarre or disabling.Snobbery in mental illness?never?CS/I have witnessed Bipolars,speaking of schizophrenics, acting like "I got (just a) mood disorder,not a thought disorder."What’s the point of comparison?How much good does it do?The DSM 4 ain’t The Bible,since it gets revised often enough to tell you how much we must have to know yet.C We all know some inflexible people,intolerant of ambiguity.that’s not really important to me.Those dx bipolar II don’t have such a great time,most i know spending lives battling severe depression.they say they have had little of the highs,sometimes wistfully,and i tell them they’re missing a lot of aggravation,& yes ,delusions,even hallucinations.Comparison is lost time.we oughta be getting better,or good as we can get,or well.That would be     nice,wouldn’t it?(i had to hace "closure")HHH     Yes it would harry…. I feel I have gotten better in the long run, but my ways are unconventional. The road less traveled…       Vicky      Well,I am more "experienced",as Jimi Hendrix might have said

   Naa, Jimi would have said "Are you experienced" ,not from drugs like Jimi took

   Jimi took a lot of drugs :-) haha! so did 3/4 of the young people that grew up in that era,,,, ain’t no big thang,,, ,but from this I was given or became,till I’m who I am.

   Well I know what it is like to hallucinate when I was perfectly straight if that’s what your getting at.. These "illnesses" I think are not so measurable,not well defined.

  I think I said that in another post but I am sure its no original thought as thoughts go. The differences between "disorders" who can distinguish?Not me.We just live,if that’s what we choose to do,the best we can,or we don’t try too hard.

  I don’t get "or we don’t try to hard" what does that mean? A doctor told me,shaking his head,"there is method to this madness".

   I suppose there is, and we just aren’t privy to it? He quit practicing shortly thereafter,he being a psychoanalyst.C

   Hmm….  Vicky

Response:

The next morning was the day I actually set out to commit suicide. The only time I’ve gone beyond thinking about it and started acting. I got interrupted by a "friend" that I don’t even like very much, but who wouldn’t leave me alone. Just kept talking and talking. He had no idea what he was interrupting. By the time he was gone and I could continue, the mood had left me. Without knowing it, he had saved my life. I feel guilty that I still don’t really like him much, and that I’ve never thanked him.

An inspiring story.  Thanks for sharing it. I wonder whether your non-friend was actually on some subconscious level aware of the good he was doing, and motivated by a desire to save you.

Response:

I wonder whether your non-friend was actually on some subconscious level aware of the good he was doing, and motivated by a desire to save you.

The same thought had occurred to me when I first read Bobby’s post.  I’d imagine that the non-friend reaized that Bobby was really feeling awful bad and wanted to help him. Or maybe God moved in mysterious was, his miracles to perform. Maggie

Response:

Doesn’t everyone get misdiagnosed thier first time if its BP in any form? I was diagnosed with MPD somewhere in my history when I met a new pdoc for the first time and only months ago I was officially diagnosed with a type of Schizophrenia along with my other illnesses but never no pdcos before gave me that diagnosis. Geeze! Its enough to bang your head in confusion.

It’s very common, and as an FP I’ve done it myself several times–started someone on an SSRI for depression, only to have the patient get worse.  Then the diagnosis of bipolar D/O occurs to me, put the patient on Depakote along with the SSRI, and miraculous results.  But I’m learning. Yesterday I diagnosed someone with depression and anxiety, but thought to ask questions like, "Do you ever go without sleep and feel like you don’t need to sleep much?"  "Risk-taking behavior?"  etc.  Her answers were in the affirmative to most of the questions, so I started her on both an SSRI and Depakote.  We’ll see how she does.

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –   Hi All,   I just read that bipolar 2 is more than just depression, But Never Delusional or Psychotic?    Is this true? If so than I was dxed incorrectly..    Vicky Yes, BP2 is more of a depressive illness with hypomanic phases, not full blown mania. It’s what I have. -H

   Hi Hiliare,  My stuff started with depression that went into a full blown psychotic break 30 years ago, then after that I had trouble thinking and reasoning for many years, I was just not the same mentally after the psychotic break… The thing is now, is that I have pretty clear thinking compared to then and the last psychosis I had was 2 years ago and it had a trigger but my reactions were off the map, full blown paranoia… then after say two weeks I am ok, take no meds and seem to be fine… then maybe 6 months later have a depression that lasts awhile and a week on a anti depressant lifts me out and I stop taking them and I am fine for maybe another 5 months or so..  What I don’t understand is with all the dxes I have had in the past after maybe seeing a shrink for maybe one or two times how they come up with the dxes… Does this sound more BP 1 to you or maybe schizo affective? I think maybe what throws them off is that I am ok for relatively long periods of time…     Vicky

Response:

   I just read that bipolar 2 is more than just depression,  But Never Delusional or Psychotic?     Is this true?  If so than I was dxed incorrectly.. I’ve been Dx BP II. I’ve never been seriously Psychotic on my own, so that part seems to be true (Once when a previous pdoc stopped some meds cold turkey, well, I was psychotic for a little while).

  Interesting :) OTOH, I have in the past been mildly delusional. Nothing really grand, like my son Ian, who is BPI gets, but I do imagine myself to be the most brilliant person on earth, God’s gift to whatever I might be obsessed with at the moment, and so on.

   I am not sure if I ever imagined myself to be the most brilliant although I do get obsessive and think I have peoples answers for them sometimes… I am not sure if that is Co dependency or a little bit of know it allness, or wanting to play Dr :0) Sorry for the play on words..    Ive become obsessed at times with reading the DSM 4 and thinking I could understand it,,, I don’t think I actually do as they have made dxing people so complicated.. Now that may not quite cut it to be fully delusional. Ian definitely makes it, he once thought that he was born in England, his real parents were international spies, they died in a car accident where they were decapitated, he survived because he was shorter. After that he lived in California with a surfer dude until he was kidnapped by a biker gang and sold in the white slave trade to Kris and me, who used him as a household slave. This story came out in a family group meeting at the Genesis center, where he was in partial treatment. In front of maybe a dozen other families.

    I guess at one time someone with these types of symptoms would be first dxed as Schizophrenic or at least Psychotic… I am curious as to what makes the distinction between Schizo stuff and Bi polar… Kris was mortified. Even more so when we found out that he’d told this to his counselor at school (why didn’t she call us?) and a lot of students.

   hmm, yeah that is strange… I found with my first episode similar to your sons that no matter how extreme I got, people really had no clue as to what was going on with me as I was not being very verbal about what thoughts were going on in my head.. This was a bit before I was Dx’d. I was *very* unstable, and completely out of touch with reality. Obviously, I should have been more worried about Ian than anything, but I was completely beyond making any logical connections between what was happening and what I was about to do. I was barely masking my internal condition from the people around me.

   Sounds like you sort of blame yourself in some ways for not being able to help your son before it got bad for him… I am sure you know or have been told it is not your fault.. The next morning was the day I actually set out to commit suicide. The only time I’ve gone beyond thinking about it and started acting. I got interrupted by a "friend" that I don’t even like very much, but who wouldn’t leave me alone. Just kept talking and talking. He had no idea what he was interrupting. By the time he was gone and I could continue, the mood had left me. Without knowing it, he had saved my life.

  That has happened to a friend of mine only it was his brother who showed up at his place.. I feel guilty that I still don’t really like him much, and that I’ve never thanked him. Wow, has *this* post drifted off topic!

   Oh not really, this stuff is all connected ..  Thanks for sharing this…  Vicky

Response:

I have bipolar type 2 and I am not delusional or psychotic.    Oh Lucky you :) I have had the pleasure of experiencing delusions psychosis, hallucinations, paranoia, the whole ball of wax… It is very frightening and something I wouldn’t wish upon anyone..    Take care,   Vicky

hi,everybody…..I am acquainted with people who are diagnosed "2".With no intention of offense,a few acted like like,"you’re "mentally ill",the severity of their symptoms not being as ,shall we say,bizarre or disabling.Snobbery in mental illness?never?CS/I have witnessed Bipolars,speaking of schizophrenics, acting like "I got (just a) mood disorder,not a thought disorder."What’s the point of comparison?How much good does it do?The DSM 4 ain’t The Bible,since it gets revised often enough to tell you how much we must have to know yet.C

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I have bipolar type 2 and I am not delusional or psychotic.    Oh Lucky you :) I have had the pleasure of experiencing delusions psychosis, hallucinations, paranoia, the whole ball of wax… It is very frightening and something I wouldn’t wish upon anyone..    Take care,   Vicky hi,everybody…..I am acquainted with people who are diagnosed "2".With no intention of offense,a few acted like like,"you’re "mentally ill",the severity of their symptoms not being as ,shall we say,bizarre or disabling.Snobbery in mental illness?never?CS/I have witnessed Bipolars,speaking of schizophrenics, acting like "I got (just a) mood disorder,not a thought disorder."What’s the point of comparison?How much good does it do?The DSM 4 ain’t The Bible,since it gets revised often enough to tell you how much we must have to know yet.C

We all know some inflexible people,intolerant of ambiguity.that’s not really important to me.Those dx bipolar II don’t have such a great time,most i know spending lives battling severe depression.they say they have had little of the highs,sometimes wistfully,and i tell them they’re missing a lot of aggravation,& yes ,delusions,even hallucinations.Comparison is lost time.we oughta be getting better,or good as we can get,or well.That would be

Response:

What I have since come to recognize as hypomania occurred, it was assumed that those eriods were good times when I was "normal" and not depressed.

No one assumed that *for* me, but I always just sort of assumed that for myself, even though, deep down, I really know that there was something wrong, at least since a really bad episode around ‘85 or so. and the spurts occurred when I wasn’t depressed.  It was amazing how wel focused I could be and how much I could accomplish during these

Speaking of "focused" and youth, that reminds me of something. I remember a party where the adults were talking about add or adhd, which was just becoming something that was talked about, or at least I so remember. I remember my mother mentioning that I couldn’t possibly have it, that it was downright scary how focused I could be on a task. Perhaps a first sign of "goal oriented activity"? — Manic depression befriends me, Hear his voice; Sanity now it’s beyond me, There’s no choice    -Ozzy Osbourne

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I have bipolar type 2 and I am not delusional or psychotic.    Oh Lucky you :) I have had the pleasure of experiencing delusions psychosis, hallucinations, paranoia, the whole ball of wax… It is very frightening and something I wouldn’t wish upon anyone..    Take care,   Vicky hi,everybody…..I am acquainted with people who are diagnosed "2".With no intention of offense,a few acted like like,"you’re "mentally ill",the severity of their symptoms not being as ,shall we say,bizarre or disabling.Snobbery in mental illness?never?CS/I have witnessed Bipolars,speaking of schizophrenics, acting like "I got (just a) mood disorder,not a thought disorder."What’s the point of comparison?How much good does it do?The DSM 4 ain’t The Bible,since it gets revised often enough to tell you how much we must have to know yet.C We all know some inflexible people,intolerant of ambiguity.that’s not really important to me.Those dx bipolar II don’t have such a great time,most i know spending lives battling severe depression.they say they have had little of the highs,sometimes wistfully,and i tell them they’re missing a lot of aggravation,& yes ,delusions,even hallucinations.Comparison is lost time.we oughta be getting better,or good as we can get,or well.That would be

    nice,wouldn’t it?(i had to hace "closure")HHH

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – <snip  What I don’t understand is with all the dxes I have had in the past after maybe seeing a shrink for maybe one or two times how they come up with the dxes… Does this sound more BP 1 to you or maybe schizo affective? I think maybe what throws them off is that I am ok for relatively long periods of time… My DX was changed from BP1 with Psychotic Features to schizo-affective because I had an absence of mood related symptoms for over 2 weeks while my psychosis continued. The two week period is the minimum, 6 months is still plausible for schizo-affective, I believe. HTH SR

  Aye, None of this is making any sense to me at this point in time.  I think schizo affective and bi polar are so inter connected it is just a matter of who or when the Drs are seeing you that determine the dx… It is probably not far off the mark that being what they call a spectrum disorder now, we could reasonably move from one point or color on the spectrum at different times…. being virtually a non static disorder..    In autism most refer to it now as a landscape as opposed to a spectrum..    No mans land would be apropos at times :)    Vicky/ with the weird sense of humor

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I have bipolar type 2 and I am not delusional or psychotic.    Oh Lucky you :) I have had the pleasure of experiencing delusions psychosis, hallucinations, paranoia, the whole ball of wax… It is very frightening and something I wouldn’t wish upon anyone..    Take care,   Vicky hi,everybody…..I am acquainted with people who are diagnosed "2".With no intention of offense,a few acted like like,"you’re "mentally ill",the severity of their symptoms not being as ,shall we say,bizarre or disabling.Snobbery in mental illness?never?CS/I have witnessed Bipolars,speaking of schizophrenics, acting like "I got (just a) mood disorder,not a thought disorder."What’s the point of comparison?How much good does it do?The DSM 4 ain’t The Bible,since it gets revised often enough to tell you how much we must have to know yet.C We all know some inflexible people,intolerant of ambiguity.that’s not really important to me.Those dx bipolar II don’t have such a great time,most i know spending lives battling severe depression.they say they have had little of the highs,sometimes wistfully,and i tell them they’re missing a lot of aggravation,& yes ,delusions,even hallucinations.Comparison is lost time.we oughta be getting better,or good as we can get,or well.That would be

As I get it,Bipolar 2 is where you get the lows,sometimes for a long time.What that sounds like is recurrent deppression,with brief flirtations with mania,but not in so far it’s hell coming back.People I know called this mysterious bipolar 2 can’t remember a manic episode-it just seems their doctor saw them on a good day which in contrast to the depression looked something like mania,or the luminous mood could have been the result of an antidepressant working,or overworking.This is obviously speculation,based on an uneducated ,sometimes guilty bystander.A sage at the pool hall told me,"You can observe a lot by just watching".It would seem that 2s have a tough time.The ones I know handle life’s course just as full of tears of rage and grief.By whatever name,anyone with a persistent (is that better than chronic?)illness suffers.Whatever the name,the playing of the game,it’s full of pitfalls and occasional joy.C

Response:

Very very interesting. We are so alike in different ways. 1/2 Alex – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Doesn’t everyone get misdiagnosed thier first time if its BP in any form? 1/2 Alex My experience was interesting from the other end of the spectrum. Because I was a ware that manic depression ran in my mother’s maternal line I ALWAYS asked psychiatrists to be sepcifially on the look out for any signs of it in me. My homelife was highly disfunctional and I was recognized by others as being severlydepressed since at least the 6th grade.  My 5th grade teacher had noticed perfectionistic tendenciesto the extend that she called my parents in to discuss it……they thought it was something to be proud of and my other actually bragged about it to her friends. I started seeing shrinks (MD types) at age 16.  I was consistantly told that because I didn’t have mania, I wasn’t BP. What I have since come to recognize as hypomania occurred, it was assumed that those eriods were good times when I was "normal" and not depressed. One of the things that surprised me the most in the list of discriptions of hypomaina symptoms was "emphasis of goal oriented behavior."  I was weel known for accommplishing great things in spurts and the spurts occurred when I wasn’t depressed.  It was amazing how wel focused I could be and how much I could accomplish during these periods. I am bright and know how to organize and break down a task.  I’ve always been good at making social connections with high achieving contemporaries…..before they were famous…..lol…..and have been a good little networker.  This has come in handy.  I also have a very good picture of who to call, who can help me and generally how to get things done when I am stable or hypomanic.  SO, it was assummed that I was a gal with remarkably good "potential" but inconsistant…..often percieved as laziness or flakiness……not living up to my full potential.  Sometimes co-wporkers thought that I just wasn’t dedicated to my job, and then resented my abibity to  pull things together with apparent ease when I rose to the occasion.    This ability was often dismissed as a fluke even though the flukes happened a whole, whole lot.  This led to having a mumber of co-workers who really didn’t like me, and were often quite mean to me. Note:  My ability to "get things done" and "Make things happen" has always been the trait I have most valued and consider one of my finest abilities.  I just wish I could do it consistantly. the last 10 years.  Perhaps this is why it was recognized sooner. Maggie.

Response:

I have bipolar type 2 and I am not delusional or psychotic. Major Depressive Episode: depressed mood most of the day, nearly every day, as indicated by either subjective report (e.g., feels sad or empty) or observation made by others (e.g., appears tearful). Note: In children and adolescents, can be irritable mood. markedly diminished interest or pleasure in all, or almost all, activities most of the day, nearly every day (as indicated by either subjective account or observation made by others) significant weight loss when not dieting or weight gain (e.g., a change of more than 5% of body weight in a month), or decrease or increase in appetite nearly every day. Note: In children, consider failure to make expected weight gains. insomnia or hypersomnia nearly every day psychomotor agitation or retardation nearly every day (observable by others, not merely subjective feelings of restlessness or being slowed down) fatigue or loss of energy nearly every day feelings of worthlessness or excessive or inappropriate guilt (which may be delusional) nearly every day (not merely self-reproach or guilt about being sick) diminished ability to think or concentrate, or indecisiveness, nearly every day (either by subjective account or as observed by others) recurrent thoughts of death (not just fear of dying), recurrent suicidal ideation without a specific plan, or a suicide attempt or a specific plan for committing suicide Hypomanic Episode:A distinct period of persistently elevated, expansive, or irritable mood, lasting throughout at least 4 days, that is clearly different from the usual nondepressed mood. During the period of mood disturbance, three (or more) of the following symptoms have persisted (four if the mood is only irritable) and have been present to a significant degree: inflated self-esteem or grandiosity decreased need for sleep (e.g., feels rested after only 3 hours of sleep) more talkative than usual or pressure to keep talking flight of ideas or subjective experience that thoughts are racing distractibility (i.e., attention too easily drawn to unimportant or irrelevant external stimuli) increase in goal-directed activity (either socially, at work or school, or sexually) or psychomotor agitation excessive involvement in pleasurable activities that have a high potential for painful consequences (e.g., the person engages in unrestrained buying sprees, sexual indiscretions, or foolish business investments) The episode is associated with an unequivocal change in functioning that is uncharacteristic of the person when not symptomatic. The disturbance in mood and the change in functioning are observable by others. The episode is not severe enough to cause marked impairment in social or occupational functioning, or to necessitate hospitalization, and there are no psychotic features. The symptoms are not due to the direct physiological effects of a substance (e.g., a drug of abuse, a medication, or other treatment) or a general medical condition (e.g., hyperthyroidism).

Response:

Doesn’t everyone get misdiagnosed thier first time if its BP in any form? I was diagnosed with MPD somewhere in my history when I met a new pdoc for the first time and only months ago I was officially diagnosed with a type of Schizophrenia along with my other illnesses but never no pdcos before gave me that diagnosis. Geeze! Its enough to bang your head in confusion. Good luck 1/2 Alex – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi All,    I just read that bipolar 2 is more than just depression,  But Never Delusional or Psychotic?     Is this true?  If so than I was dxed incorrectly..     Vicky

Response:

I have bipolar type 2 and I am not delusional or psychotic.

   Oh Lucky you :) I have had the pleasure of experiencing delusions psychosis, hallucinations, paranoia, the whole ball of wax… It is very frightening and something I wouldn’t wish upon anyone..    Take care,   Vicky

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi All,    I just read that bipolar 2 is more than just depression,  But Never Delusional or Psychotic?     Is this true?  If so than I was dxed incorrectly..     Vicky My understand is this: History of depressive episodes.  At least one incident of hypomania (mania light…you get a little higher than just being in a good mood.) And a family history of manic depression. That’s the opening bid, and pretty much describes my situation.  For me, the depresson is the primry issue. Maggie

   Thanks Maggie    Vicky

Response:

   Hi All,    I just read that bipolar 2 is more than just depression,  But Never Delusional or Psychotic?     Is this true?  If so than I was dxed incorrectly..     Vicky

Response:

  Hi All,   I just read that bipolar 2 is more than just depression, But Never Delusional or Psychotic?    Is this true? If so than I was dxed incorrectly..    Vicky

Yes, BP2 is more of a depressive illness with hypomanic phases, not full blown mania. It’s what I have. -H

Response:

   I just read that bipolar 2 is more than just depression,  But Never Delusional or Psychotic?     Is this true?  If so than I was dxed incorrectly..

I’ve been Dx BP II. I’ve never been seriously Psychotic on my own, so that part seems to be true (Once when a previous pdoc stopped some meds cold turkey, well, I was psychotic for a little while). OTOH, I have in the past been mildly delusional. Nothing really grand, like my son Ian, who is BPI gets, but I do imagine myself to be the most brilliant person on earth, God’s gift to whatever I might be obsessed with at the moment, and so on. Now that may not quite cut it to be fully delusional. Ian definitely makes it, he once thought that he was born in England, his real parents were international spies, they died in a car accident where they were decapitated, he survived because he was shorter. After that he lived in California with a surfer dude until he was kidnapped by a biker gang and sold in the white slave trade to Kris and me, who used him as a household slave. This story came out in a family group meeting at the Genesis center, where he was in partial treatment. In front of maybe a dozen other families. Kris was mortified. Even more so when we found out that he’d told this to his counselor at school (why didn’t she call us?) and a lot of students. This was a bit before I was Dx’d. I was *very* unstable, and completely out of touch with reality. Obviously, I should have been more worried about Ian than anything, but I was completely beyond making any logical connections between what was happening and what I was about to do. I was barely masking my internal condition from the people around me. The next morning was the day I actually set out to commit suicide. The only time I’ve gone beyond thinking about it and started acting. I got interrupted by a "friend" that I don’t even like very much, but who wouldn’t leave me alone. Just kept talking and talking. He had no idea what he was interrupting. By the time he was gone and I could continue, the mood had left me. Without knowing it, he had saved my life. I feel guilty that I still don’t really like him much, and that I’ve never thanked him. Wow, has *this* post drifted off topic! — Manic depression befriends me, Hear his voice; Sanity now it’s beyond me, There’s no choice    -Ozzy Osbourne

Response:

Concerned….

Question:

I don’t have money for a doctor. I was looking for some general symptoms etc. Just a clue.. a little insight perhaps. At this very moment, I am feeling completely and totally alone. I dont have enough money for a doctor and make to much money for free or sliding scale services. This dilema only makes whatever I am going through that much worse. So thanks anyway..  :-(

X-No-Archive: yes To be diagnosed, you’ll have to see a psychiatrist.  Even if you could self-diagnose, how would you medicate?  No way to medicate yourself. See a psychiatrist. — HyperBum – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi, How do you know if you have bi-polar, uni-polar/manic depression etc…? Is there a list of symptoms that are common? Is there an informative place one can go to research this and find out? Thanks for your help, Darla

Response:

Yes I just found it. Thank you very much. And thank you to all who have replied to my post. I have since found many insightful websites to study about mental health and personality disorders… etc.. Unfortunately and fortunately, I am in the correct group. I will start reading the posts and sharing sometimes too. Darla

Thank you for the advice, but I am such a newbie that I have no clue to to get to the FAQ of any newsgroup. I am using Outlook Express 6. I had a very nice person help me get this far.

I post it here twice a week.  I just posted it this morning–you should see it as a regular post here.  Do you see it? Nancy administrator/creator/moderator alt.med.fibromyalgia.recovery.info (moderated) alt.support.depression.manic.moderated to email me from news groups, just remove the Z.

Response:

Thank you for the advice, but I am such a newbie that I have no clue to to get to the FAQ of any newsgroup. I am using Outlook Express 6. I had a very nice person help me get this far.

I post it here twice a week.  I just posted it this morning–you should see it as a regular post here.  Do you see it? Nancy administrator/creator/moderator alt.med.fibromyalgia.recovery.info (moderated) alt.support.depression.manic.moderated to email me from news groups, just remove the Z.

Response:

I don’t have money for a doctor. I was looking for some general symptoms etc. Just a clue.. a little insight perhaps.

Contact your County Mental Health office–they can help you get the help you need. Nancy administrator/creator/moderator alt.med.fibromyalgia.recovery.info (moderated) alt.support.depression.manic.moderated to email me from news groups, just remove the Z.

Response:

Thanks Nancy

I don’t have money for a doctor. I was looking for some general symptoms etc. Just a clue.. a little insight perhaps.

Contact your County Mental Health office–they can help you get the help you need. Nancy administrator/creator/moderator alt.med.fibromyalgia.recovery.info (moderated) alt.support.depression.manic.moderated to email me from news groups, just remove the Z.

Response:

Thank you   :-)

X-No-Archive: yes You might be eligible for some form of disability.  I am not an expert on this, but try your local Social Security office for some help.  I had no idea you were in such financial straits when I made my comments.  However, I don’t change what I said, for real help, you are going to need a psychiatrist.  There ARE ways to get help and there are also reduced med programs as well. I wish you well.  As for some things to read, just go to Google and type in "bipolar disorder" and you’ll find loads to read.  As for questions you may have, just post them to the group and you’ll get some input. Take care, — HyperBum – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I don’t have money for a doctor. I was looking for some general symptoms etc. Just a clue.. a little insight perhaps. At this very moment, I am feeling completely and totally alone. I dont have enough money for a doctor and make to much money for free or sliding scale services. This dilema only makes whatever I am going through that much worse. So thanks anyway..  :-( X-No-Archive: yes To be diagnosed, you’ll have to see a psychiatrist.  Even if you could self-diagnose, how would you medicate?  No way to medicate yourself. See a psychiatrist. — HyperBum Hi, How do you know if you have bi-polar, uni-polar/manic depression etc…? Is there a list of symptoms that are common? Is there an informative place one can go to research this and find out? Thanks for your help, Darla

Response:

Can you explain your delima?  how do you feel and what’s going on? Ask these of your slef.  then i stongly suggest you read Kay Redfield Jamison’s "an unquiet mind" and "Touched With Fire:  Manic Depression and the Artistic Temperment" and see what happens. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I don’t have money for a doctor. I was looking for some general symptoms etc. Just a clue.. a little insight perhaps. At this very moment, I am feeling completely and totally alone. I dont have enough money for a doctor and make to much money for free or sliding scale services. This dilema only makes whatever I am going through that much worse. So thanks anyway..  :-( X-No-Archive: yes To be diagnosed, you’ll have to see a psychiatrist.  Even if you could self-diagnose, how would you medicate?  No way to medicate yourself. See a psychiatrist. — HyperBum Hi, How do you know if you have bi-polar, uni-polar/manic depression etc…? Is there a list of symptoms that are common? Is there an informative place one can go to research this and find out? Thanks for your help, Darla

Response:

Here are the standard criteria as per DSM (diagnostic statistical manual of mental disorders).   Like people here imply, if you are concerned enough to write to us you should find a good psychiatrist. Criteria for Major Depressive Episode (DSM-IV, p. 327) A. Five (or more) of the following symptoms have been present during the same 2-week period and represent a change from previous functioning; at least one of the symptoms is either (1) depressed mood or (2) loss of interest or pleasure. Note: Do not include symptoms that are clearly due to a general medical condition, or mood-incongruent delusions or hallucinations. 1.      depressed mood most of the day, nearly every day, as indicated by either subjective report (e.g., feels sad or empty) or observation made by others (e.g. appears tearful). Note: In children and adolescents, can be irritable mood. 2.      markedly diminished interest or pleasure in all, or almost all, activities most of the day, nearly every day (as indicated by either subjective account or observation made by others) 3.      significant weight loss when not dieting or weight gain (e.g., a change of more than 5% of body weight in a month), or decrease or increase in appetite nearly every day. Note: In children, consider failure to make expected weight gains. 4.      insomnia or hypersomnia nearly every day 5.      psychomotor agitation or retardation nearly every day (observable by others, not merely subjective feelings of restlessness or being slowed down) 6.      fatigue or loss of energy nearly every day 7.      feelings of worthlessness or excessive or inappropriate guilt (which may be delusional) nearly every day (not merely self-reproach or guilt about being sick) 8.      diminished ability to think or concentrate, or indecisiveness, nearly every day (either by subjective account or as observed by others) 9.      recurrent thoughts of death (not just fear of dying), recurrent suicidal ideation without a specific plan, or a suicide attempt or a specific plan for committing suicide B. The symptoms do not meet criteria for a Mixed Episode. C. The symptoms cause clinically significant distress or impairment in social, occupational, or other important areas of functioning. D. The symptoms are not due to the direct physiological effects of a substance (e.g., a drug of abuse, a medication) or a general medical condition (e.g., hypothyroidism). E. The symptoms are not better accounted for by bereavement, i.e., after the loss of a loved one, the symptoms persist for longer than 2 months or are characterized by marked functional impairment, morbid preoccupation with worthlessness, suicidal ideation, psychotic symptoms, or psychomotor retardation. Criteria for Manic Episode (DSM-IV, p. 332) A. A distinct period of abnormally and persistently elevated, expansive, or irritable mood, lasting at least 1 week (or any duration if hospitalization is necessary). B. During the period of mood disturbance, three (or more) of the following symptoms have persisted (four if the mood is only irritable) and have been present to a significant degree: 1.      inflated self-esteem or grandiosity 2.      decreased need for sleep (e.g., feels rested after only 3 hours of sleep) 3.      more talkative than usual or pressure to keep talking 4.      flight of ideas or subjective experience that thoughts are racing 5.      distractibility (i.e., attention too easily drawn to unimportant or irrelevant external stimuli) 6.      increase in goal-directed activity (either socially, at work or school, or sexually) or psychomotor agitation 7.      excessive involvement in pleasurable activities that have a high potential for painful consequences (e.g., engaging in unrestrained buying sprees, sexual indiscretions, or foolish business investments) C. The symptoms do not meet criteria for a Mixed Episode. D. The mood disturbance is sufficiently severe to cause marked impairment in occupational functioning or in usual social activities or relationships with others, or to necessitate hospitalization to prevent harm to self or others, or there are psychotic features. E. The symptoms are not due to the direct physiological effects of a substance (e.g., a drug of abuse, a medication, or other treatments) or a general medical condition (e.g., hyperthyroidism). Note: Manic-like episodes that are clearly caused by somatic antidepressant treatment (e.g., medication, electroconvulsive therapy, light therapy) should not count toward a diagnosis of Bipolar I Disorder. Criteria for Mixed Episode (DSM-IV, p. 335) A. The criteria are met both for a Manic Episode and for a Major Depressive Episode (except for duration) nearly every day during at least a 1-week period. B. The mood disturbance is sufficiently severe to cause marked impairment in occupational functioning or in usual social activities or relationships with others, or to necessitate hospitalization to prevent harm to self or others, or there are psychotic features. C. The symptoms are not due to the direct physiological effects of a substance (e.g., a drug of abuse, a medication, or other treatment) or a general medical condition (e.g., hyperthyroidism). Criteria for Hypomanic Episode (DSM-IV, p. 338) A. A distinct period of persistently elevated, expansive, or irritable mood, lasting throughout at least 4 days, that is clearly different from the usual nondepressed mood. B. During the period of mood disturbance, three (or more) of the following symptoms have persisted (four if the mood is only irritable) and have been present to a significant degree: 1.      inflated self-esteem or grandiosity 2.      decreased need for sleep (e.g., feels rested after only 3 hours of sleep) 3.      more talkative than usual or pressure to keep talking 4.      flight of ideas or subjective experience that thoughts are racing 5.      distractibility (i.e., attention too easily drawn to unimportant or irrelevant external stimuli) 6.      increase in goal-directed activity (either socially, at work or school, or sexually) or psychomotor agitation 7.      excessive involvement in pleasurable activities that have a high potential for painful consequences (e.g., engaging in unrestrained buying sprees, sexual indiscretions, or foolish business investments) C. The episode is associated with an unequivocal change in functioning that is uncharacteristic of the person when not symptomatic. D. The disturbance in mood and the change in functioning are observable by others. E. The episode is not severe enough to cause marked impairment in social or occupational functioning, or to necessitate hospitalization, and there are no psychotic features. F. The symptoms are not due to the direct physiological effects of a substance (e.g., a drug of abuse, a medication, or other treatment) or a general medical condition (e.g., hyperthyroidism). Note: Hypomanic-like episodes that are clearly caused by somatic antidepressant treatment (e.g., medication, electroconvulsive therapy, light therapy) should not count toward a diagnosis of Bipolar II Disorder.

Response:

Someone classifies you  . . . that’s how.  Or messes around with established classifications like it looks like someone did in your case.  You find out what your specific problems are and how they interfere with your life and then you treat them.  Screw the classification system. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi, How do you know if you have bi-polar, uni-polar/manic depression etc…? Is there a list of symptoms that are common? Is there an informative place one can go to research this and find out? Thanks for your help, Darla

Response:

Hi Kathy, Yes and no about the dachshunds. I had 2 boys, but recently had to find them a new home. My user name is a tribute to them. They gave me many years of love and support.  I look forward to the day when I can get a couple more. Thank you for the advice, but I am such a newbie that I have no clue to to get to the FAQ of any newsgroup. I am using Outlook Express 6. I had a very nice person help me get this far. Thanks, Darla Darla, I love your user name!  There’s a sweet dachshund who kisses and hugs me every morning as I do the carpool for a little private school everyday. Do you have one?  We seem to be on a pet thread here these days; write us about yours. You can go to this group’s FAQ list and learn a great deal; it’s a good starting place.  Let us know how we can help, OK?  Welcome to the group! Kathy – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi, How do you know if you have bi-polar, uni-polar/manic depression etc…? Is there a list of symptoms that are common? Is there an informative place one can go to research this and find out? Thanks for your help, Darla

Response:

Hi, How do you know if you have bi-polar, uni-polar/manic depression etc…? Is there a list of symptoms that are common? Is there an informative place one can go to research this and find out? Thanks for your help, Darla

Response:

Darla, I love your user name!  There’s a sweet dachshund who kisses and hugs me every morning as I do the carpool for a little private school everyday. Do you have one?  We seem to be on a pet thread here these days; write us about yours. You can go to this group’s FAQ list and learn a great deal; it’s a good starting place.  Let us know how we can help, OK?  Welcome to the group! Kathy – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi, How do you know if you have bi-polar, uni-polar/manic depression etc…? Is there a list of symptoms that are common? Is there an informative place one can go to research this and find out? Thanks for your help, Darla

Response:

Bad night & morning :-(

Question:

Thanks to all of you great guys out there who replied.  :-)  I read all your replies btw.  I hope each and every one of you gets through the struggles that are plaguing you.  I took it easy yesterday, took a whole Ativan before bed and did sleep much, much better than I have been lately.  We went to the grocery store this morning when it first opened to get a few things and we didn’t have to stand in any line at all.  Yippppeeeeee!  I am relieved about that.  We’re having overnight company tonight and then we’re going to try the bank tomorrow.  We’re also having company on Christmas Day.  I guess I just got myself overwhelmed by everything.  And it is definitely a vicious cycle, anxiety and insomnia!  My dentist’s office is closed now until the Tues. after New Year’s so if the tooth flares up I can go to the clinic down the street if I need to.  I know what’s bothering me, when I go for the cleaning on Jan. 17 the dentist will tell me how many teeth need to be redone.  This is something I’ve been worrying about almost constantly because I can’t even stand a filling replacement.  Ugh!  I could feel my anxiety raising more and more every day.  I think I have enough Ativan to get me through until I can get an appt. in Feb., but I still don’t have enough to take every day.  I really don’t think I *need* to take it every day either so we’ll see what happens.  I know so many of you are struggling out there and I truly hope things get better for you soon.  Thanks again for being here for me.  I don’t know what I’d do without you. Love, Di

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I slept maybe 4 hours last night and jumped in between.  Had so much anxiety I felt like I was going nuts!  One of my teeth started bothering me and this happened a few weeks ago too.  I’ll have it checked out when I go for my cleaning unless it really flares up.  All I could think about last night was the tooth, the cap and the old fillings that need replacing, how I need to go to the bank today (long story), and that I couldn’t fickin sleep for anything!  I cried this morning and still had anxiety.  Part of this is perimenopause, I know.  I took a chip of Ativan and will try the bank on Mon.  I hate putting things off because when I do something (almost) always seems to happen and then I wish I hadn’t put it off.  I’m not really that depressed, not enough to go on a med.  It’s the anxiety that’s really getting to me.  I guess I feel extra overwhelmed this week and I can’t get the dentist out of my mind.  I’m so exhausted and sick of this insomnia. I have a few things I can take, but not every night.  I take something every once in a while just to be able to sleep that night.  I’m sick of this. :-( Di

Response:

Di, Hugs

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Thanks to all of you great guys out there who replied.  :-)  I read all your replies btw.  I hope each and every one of you gets through the struggles that are plaguing you.  I took it easy yesterday, took a whole Ativan before bed and did sleep much, much better than I have been lately.  We went to the grocery store this morning when it first opened to get a few things and we didn’t have to stand in any line at all.  Yippppeeeeee!  I am relieved about that.  We’re having overnight company tonight and then we’re going to try the bank tomorrow.  We’re also having company on Christmas Day.  I guess I just got myself overwhelmed by everything.  And it is definitely a vicious cycle, anxiety and insomnia!  My dentist’s office is closed now until the Tues. after New Year’s so if the tooth flares up I can go to the clinic down the street if I need to.  I know what’s bothering me, when I go for the cleaning on Jan. 17 the dentist will tell me how many teeth need to be redone.  This is something I’ve been worrying about almost constantly because I can’t even stand a filling replacement.  Ugh!  I could feel my anxiety raising more and more every day.  I think I have enough Ativan to get me through until I can get an appt. in Feb., but I still don’t have enough to take every day.  I really don’t think I *need* to take it every day either so we’ll see what happens.  I know so many of you are struggling out there and I truly hope things get better for you soon.  Thanks again for being here for me.  I don’t know what I’d do without you. Love, Di I slept maybe 4 hours last night and jumped in between.  Had so much anxiety I felt like I was going nuts!  One of my teeth started bothering me and this happened a few weeks ago too.  I’ll have it checked out when I go for my cleaning unless it really flares up.  All I could think about last night was the tooth, the cap and the old fillings that need replacing, how I need to go to the bank today (long story), and that I couldn’t fickin sleep for anything!  I cried this morning and still had anxiety.  Part of this is perimenopause, I know.  I took a chip of Ativan and will try the bank on Mon.  I hate putting things off because when I do something (almost) always seems to happen and then I wish I hadn’t put it off.  I’m not really that depressed, not enough to go on a med.  It’s the anxiety that’s really getting to me.  I guess I feel extra overwhelmed this week and I can’t get the dentist out of my mind.  I’m so exhausted and sick of this insomnia. I have a few things I can take, but not every night.  I take something every once in a while just to be able to sleep that night.  I’m sick of this. :-( Di

Response:

(((((Di))))) Thinking of you tonight….  hope it’s all going OK with your company. xxoo Anne

Response:

: I know what’s bothering me, when I go for the :cleaning on Jan. 17 the dentist will tell me how many teeth need to be :redone.  This is something I’ve been worrying about almost constantly :because I can’t even stand a filling replacement.  Ugh!  I could feel my :anxiety raising more and more every day.   Dear Di, Glad to hear you slept well and are doing better. Good luck with your company…….I hope you can enjoy the visits. Are you positive the dentist will tell you that your teeth need to be redone or are you worried that`s what he`ll say? So often we worry about things that never come to be. Maybe the appt will go better than you imagine. Take care! {{{{{Di}}}}} Jackie ~*~The dream was always running ahead of me. To catch up, to live for a moment in unison with it, that was the miracle~*~   ~Anais Ninn~

Response:

Dear Di, Insomnia sucks. It is so debilitating. Remember you do not need all of this dental work. I hope you make it to the bank on Monday, but if you don’t life will go on. love Meryl

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I slept maybe 4 hours last night and jumped in between.  Had so much anxiety I felt like I was going nuts!  One of my teeth started bothering me and this happened a few weeks ago too.  I’ll have it checked out when I go for my cleaning unless it really flares up.  All I could think about last night was the tooth, the cap and the old fillings that need replacing, how I need to go to the bank today (long story), and that I couldn’t fickin sleep for anything!  I cried this morning and still had anxiety.  Part of this is perimenopause, I know.  I took a chip of Ativan and will try the bank on Mon.  I hate putting things off because when I do something (almost) always seems to happen and then I wish I hadn’t put it off.  I’m not really that depressed, not enough to go on a med.  It’s the anxiety that’s really getting to me.  I guess I feel extra overwhelmed this week and I can’t get the dentist out of my mind.  I’m so exhausted and sick of this insomnia. I have a few things I can take, but not every night.  I take something every once in a while just to be able to sleep that night.  I’m sick of this. :-( Di

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I slept maybe 4 hours last night and jumped in between.  Had so much anxiety I felt like I was going nuts!  One of my teeth started bothering me and this happened a few weeks ago too.  I’ll have it checked out when I go for my cleaning unless it really flares up.  All I could think about last night was the tooth, the cap and the old fillings that need replacing, how I need to go to the bank today (long story), and that I couldn’t fickin sleep for anything!  I cried this morning and still had anxiety.  Part of this is perimenopause, I know.  I took a chip of Ativan and will try the bank on Mon.  I hate putting things off because when I do something (almost) always seems to happen and then I wish I hadn’t put it off.  I’m not really that depressed, not enough to go on a med.  It’s the anxiety that’s really getting to me.  I guess I feel extra overwhelmed this week and I can’t get the dentist out of my mind.  I’m so exhausted and sick of this insomnia. I have a few things I can take, but not every night.  I take something every once in a while just to be able to sleep that night.  I’m sick of this. :-( Di

Hi Di, sorry to hear you a bit down and anxious right now. I hope you get to have a good nights sleep. It’s such a vicious cycle. Lack of sleep makes our anxiety and negative thoughts worse, which in turn can keep us awake at night. You have quite a bit on your mind ATM. Hope you get the bank stuff sorted on Monday. Try not to worry too much about the dental work, can you hold off until your next appt with the dentist? If not try and make an earlier appt so at least you can get some re-assurance. Take it easy, try not to worry over the little things. Easier said than done huh? Vanessa :) )

Response:

Dear Di, I can relate to the insomnia.  It is driving me nuts these days, as well.  I have found when I don’t get enough sleep things just seem so much harder to handle and the anxiety does seem worse.  I do hope you feel better soon. Maybe later you could take a little nap and try to relax for a bit.  Take care of yourself. Love, Vicki

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I slept maybe 4 hours last night and jumped in between.  Had so much anxiety I felt like I was going nuts!  One of my teeth started bothering me and this happened a few weeks ago too.  I’ll have it checked out when I go for my cleaning unless it really flares up.  All I could think about last night was the tooth, the cap and the old fillings that need replacing, how I need to go to the bank today (long story), and that I couldn’t fickin sleep for anything!  I cried this morning and still had anxiety.  Part of this is perimenopause, I know.  I took a chip of Ativan and will try the bank on Mon.  I hate putting things off because when I do something (almost) always seems to happen and then I wish I hadn’t put it off.  I’m not really that depressed, not enough to go on a med.  It’s the anxiety that’s really getting to me.  I guess I feel extra overwhelmed this week and I can’t get the dentist out of my mind.  I’m so exhausted and sick of this insomnia. I have a few things I can take, but not every night.  I take something every once in a while just to be able to sleep that night.  I’m sick of this. :-( Di

Response:

I’m sorry you’re having a tough morning Lady Di. I know I used to hate going to the dentist — part of the reason I haven’t seen a dentist in years. Insomnia is the pits. I don’t know if this helps but one of my friends takes ambien for insomnia — he says it’s never failed him yet and doesn’t leave him groggy in the a.m. -Doug (remove "botizer" from email addy to respond)

Response:

I slept maybe 4 hours last night and jumped in between.  Had so much anxiety I felt like I was going nuts!  One of my teeth started bothering me and this happened a few weeks ago too.  I’ll have it checked out when I go for my cleaning unless it really flares up.  All I could think about last night was the tooth, the cap and the old fillings that need replacing, how I need to go to the bank today (long story), and that I couldn’t fickin sleep for anything!  I cried this morning and still had anxiety.  Part of this is perimenopause, I know.  I took a chip of Ativan and will try the bank on Mon.  I hate putting things off because when I do something (almost) always seems to happen and then I wish I hadn’t put it off.  I’m not really that depressed, not enough to go on a med.  It’s the anxiety that’s really getting to me.  I guess I feel extra overwhelmed this week and I can’t get the dentist out of my mind.  I’m so exhausted and sick of this insomnia.  I have a few things I can take, but not every night.  I take something every once in a while just to be able to sleep that night.  I’m sick of this.  :-( Di

Response:

Di, I am sorry you are going through such a bad time.  I do want you to know that I care and you are not alone.  ((((((((((((((((((Di)))))))))))))))

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I slept maybe 4 hours last night and jumped in between.  Had so much anxiety I felt like I was going nuts!  One of my teeth started bothering me and this happened a few weeks ago too.  I’ll have it checked out when I go for my cleaning unless it really flares up.  All I could think about last night was the tooth, the cap and the old fillings that need replacing, how I need to go to the bank today (long story), and that I couldn’t fickin sleep for anything!  I cried this morning and still had anxiety.  Part of this is perimenopause, I know.  I took a chip of Ativan and will try the bank on Mon.  I hate putting things off because when I do something (almost) always seems to happen and then I wish I hadn’t put it off.  I’m not really that depressed, not enough to go on a med.  It’s the anxiety that’s really getting to me.  I guess I feel extra overwhelmed this week and I can’t get the dentist out of my mind.  I’m so exhausted and sick of this insomnia. I have a few things I can take, but not every night.  I take something every once in a while just to be able to sleep that night.  I’m sick of this. :-( Di

Response:

Di, I am sorry to hear that you aren’t doing well right now.  Is there anything stopping you from taking a regular dose of ativan?  That might smooth things out for you.  Just a thought.  Thinking of you. Jess

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I slept maybe 4 hours last night and jumped in between.  Had so much anxiety I felt like I was going nuts!  One of my teeth started bothering me and this happened a few weeks ago too.  I’ll have it checked out when I go for my cleaning unless it really flares up.  All I could think about last night was the tooth, the cap and the old fillings that need replacing, how I need to go to the bank today (long story), and that I couldn’t fickin sleep for anything!  I cried this morning and still had anxiety.  Part of this is perimenopause, I know.  I took a chip of Ativan and will try the bank on Mon.  I hate putting things off because when I do something (almost) always seems to happen and then I wish I hadn’t put it off.  I’m not really that depressed, not enough to go on a med.  It’s the anxiety that’s really getting to me.  I guess I feel extra overwhelmed this week and I can’t get the dentist out of my mind.  I’m so exhausted and sick of this insomnia. I have a few things I can take, but not every night.  I take something every once in a while just to be able to sleep that night.  I’m sick of this. :-( Di

Response:

Hi, Di, Sorry you are having a rough time with anxiety.  Do you go to the dentist this week?  Is that why you are feeling anxious?  Or is it Christmas? Please do something fun and relaxing today…  Even just take a walk with Don and get out of the house… smiles, Elise

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I slept maybe 4 hours last night and jumped in between.  Had so much anxiety I felt like I was going nuts!  One of my teeth started bothering me and this happened a few weeks ago too.  I’ll have it checked out when I go for my cleaning unless it really flares up.  All I could think about last night was the tooth, the cap and the old fillings that need replacing, how I need to go to the bank today (long story), and that I couldn’t fickin sleep for anything!  I cried this morning and still had anxiety.  Part of this is perimenopause, I know.  I took a chip of Ativan and will try the bank on Mon.  I hate putting things off because when I do something (almost) always seems to happen and then I wish I hadn’t put it off.  I’m not really that depressed, not enough to go on a med.  It’s the anxiety that’s really getting to me.  I guess I feel extra overwhelmed this week and I can’t get the dentist out of my mind.  I’m so exhausted and sick of this insomnia. I have a few things I can take, but not every night.  I take something every once in a while just to be able to sleep that night.  I’m sick of this. :-( Di

Response:

I slept maybe 4 hours last night and jumped in between.  Had so much anxiety I felt like I was going nuts! I cried this morning and still had anxiety.  Part of this is perimenopause, I know.  I took a chip of Ativan and will try the bank on Mon.  I hate putting things off because when I do something (almost) always seems to happen and then I wish I hadn’t put it off.  I’m not really that depressed, not enough to go on a med.  It’s the anxiety that’s really getting to me.

I have had increased anxiety lately, and it’s due to my depression. The anxiety makes my muscles feel tight and tense. It’s a very unpleasant sensation. I take Xanax 1 mg and that helps alot with the tension, and is calming as well. I guess I feel extra overwhelmed this week and I can’t get the dentist out of my mind.  I’m so exhausted and sick of this insomnia.

I feel overwhelmed myself lately, so I just take one day at a time. As the day wears on, I tend to feel better so that I am able to get a few things accomplished, like cleaning and paperwork, etc. I have a few things I can take, but not every night.  I take something every once in a while just to be able to sleep that night.  I’m sick of this.

:-( My depression tends to make me sleep more than usual (i.e. hypersomnia). Last night I slept 10 hours. But it is a restless sleep and I tend to wake up alot during the night. I increased my dose of Zoloft and am hoping I get some relief from the depression in a few weeks. I hope you feel better soon (((Di))) Di

Love, Chip

Response:

I slept maybe 4 hours last night and jumped in between.  Had so much anxiety I felt like I was going nuts!  

Hi Diane!  You are not going nuts.  This is a very stressful time of year for some of us.  Do your best today to eliminate any stressfilled tasks that you really don’t need to do.  Be very good to yourself, dear friend. I took Ativan at two different times on the day I got the notice about jury duty.  I also took one yesterday before going to the doctor.  I hadn’t taken any in a long time, but have felt more sensitive lately to stress. Marc is coming home tonight and staying for a week, so I am really excited about spending time with him.  He is a really interesting person.  It is going to be a peaceful Christmas. Thinking of you today. Take care, Liz – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – One of my teeth started bothering me and this happened a few weeks ago too.  I’ll have it checked out when I go for my cleaning unless it really flares up.  All I could think about last night was the tooth, the cap and the old fillings that need replacing, how I need to go to the bank today (long story), and that I couldn’t fickin sleep for anything!  I cried this morning and still had anxiety.  Part of this is perimenopause, I know.  I took a chip of Ativan and will try the bank on Mon.  I hate putting things off because when I do something (almost) always seems to happen and then I wish I hadn’t put it off.  I’m not really that depressed, not enough to go on a med.  It’s the anxiety that’s really getting to me.  I guess I feel extra overwhelmed this week and I can’t get the dentist out of my mind.  I’m so exhausted and sick of this insomnia.  I have a few things I can take, but not every night.  I take something every once in a while just to be able to sleep that night.  I’m sick of this.  :-( Di

Response:

Dumb Neuro Bi**c

Question:

Sorry you had that experience with that neuro.  She doesn’t sound to bright! But thankfully you’ll get to try the Provigil.  It helps me.  My insurance pays for it for MS fatigue.  Hopefully you’ll get it too. Angel ___ <AngelsLulla…@webtv.net> wrote in message

news:15117-3DBB1488-490@storefull-2131.public.lawson.webtv.net… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Hi all. Well, I am just checking in. I went to my neuro Thurs. Not the > good neuro I raved so much about last year, but the new, resident, free, > neuro. I had some concerns abut my MS, and she did a quick neuro exam > and told me I looked "like a peach." She said I had no, absoltely no, > neurological sx. Well, that would be all well and good if I hadn’t told > her about the numbness that I have that comes and goes, usually staying > for 48 hours or more. Or if I hadn’t told her about the burning > sensations I have almost every day. Or if I hadn’t told her about my > declining memory and incontinence problems. Still, she pronounced me > fine and told me to come back in 6 months. She did, at least, give me > new scripts for my meds. > When I asked her about the cognitive problems, and about the > incontinence issue, and about the fatigue, she told me that I shouldn’t > address those questions to her, but to my primary care doc, that I don’t > have. WHAT?????? Isn’t a neuro supposed to address these issues? She > said that while they can all be caused by the MS, she didn’t think mine > was because I was doing "so well." Helloooooo lady……ever read > anything about MS?? > The doctor at the sleep clinic that I went to Friday did a more thorough > neurological exam than the neuro did. She told me I have idiopathc > hypersomnia, which is a form of narcolepsy. She prescribed me Provigil. > YAY. I had been wanting to try it for fatigue, anyway.Now, I just need > to figure out how to pay for it….The patient assistance program won’t > help, cause my dx isn’t a firm dx of narcolepsy. Just a form of it. > Sucks, but oh well. They gave me a coupon to get 7 days of it free, > anyway. This way I can at least see if it will help me. > Sorry to ramble on so much. I am just really frustrated with this neuro. > Angel > ~~~Depression is merely anger without enthusiasm.~~~ > ~~~Dancing is a perpendicular statement of a horizontal desire.~~~

Response:

Hi all. Well, I am just checking in. I went to my neuro Thurs. Not the good neuro I raved so much about last year, but the new, resident, free, neuro. I had some concerns abut my MS, and she did a quick neuro exam and told me I looked "like a peach." She said I had no, absoltely no, neurological sx. Well, that would be all well and good if I hadn’t told her about the numbness that I have that comes and goes, usually staying for 48 hours or more. Or if I hadn’t told her about the burning sensations I have almost every day. Or if I hadn’t told her about my declining memory and incontinence problems. Still, she pronounced me fine and told me to come back in 6 months. She did, at least, give me new scripts for my meds. When I asked her about the cognitive problems, and about the incontinence issue, and about the fatigue, she told me that I shouldn’t address those questions to her, but to my primary care doc, that I don’t have. WHAT?????? Isn’t a neuro supposed to address these issues? She said that while they can all be caused by the MS, she didn’t think mine was because I was doing "so well." Helloooooo lady……ever read anything about MS?? The doctor at the sleep clinic that I went to Friday did a more thorough neurological exam than the neuro did. She told me I have idiopathc hypersomnia, which is a form of narcolepsy. She prescribed me Provigil. YAY. I had been wanting to try it for fatigue, anyway.Now, I just need to figure out how to pay for it….The patient assistance program won’t help, cause my dx isn’t a firm dx of narcolepsy. Just a form of it. Sucks, but oh well. They gave me a coupon to get 7 days of it free, anyway. This way I can at least see if it will help me. Sorry to ramble on so much. I am just really frustrated with this neuro. Angel ~~~Depression is merely anger without enthusiasm.~~~ ~~~Dancing is a perpendicular statement of a horizontal desire.~~~

Response:

What does it mean if your mood is better at night than say in the morning/afternoon?

Question:

in severe depressions I usually wake hopeless,and start improving after 9 p.m. through 2 a. m. the clocks around here can`t agree on anything.Life happens to us when and whether or not we`re ready.thanks for listening.Henry

Response:

Could mean you are a nightowl.  Or could mean you have the pattern known as a depressive episode with atypical features,  defined in DSM as depression accompanied by the following: A. Mood reactivity (i.e., mood brightens in response to actual or potential positive events)

Tired….still….

Question:

"Carl J." <c…@europa.lonestar.remove.org> wrote: >> Carl….. I can’t imagine any situation where untreated sleep apnea >> could make you unemployable.   >I’ve read lots of people’s unfortunate stories here about how untreated sleep >apnea can make it quite hard to function (like this thread) and by reading >such posts here I can "imagine" it very easily.  

I think the key here is _undiagnosed_ sleep apnea, the side effects can easily make you unemployable. Once diagnosed, most people get relief and have no need for compensation. Tom

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -In article <fefhnu4k9k2cqo2cripkuvaivs4kbnl…@4ax.com>, Tom Devlin wrote: > "Carl J." <c…@europa.lonestar.remove.org> wrote: >>> Carl….. I can’t imagine any situation where untreated sleep apnea >>> could make you unemployable.   >>I’ve read lots of people’s unfortunate stories here about how untreated sleep >>apnea can make it quite hard to function (like this thread) and by reading >>such posts here I can "imagine" it very easily.   > I think the key here is _undiagnosed_ sleep apnea, the side effects > can easily make you unemployable. > Once diagnosed, most people get relief and have no need for > compensation. > Tom

True.  But some people do not get adequate relief after being diagnosed.   Either because CPAP does not help for some reason or because they developed other conditions, known or unknown, from a long period of undiagnosed apnea.

Response:

"NormC" <no…@socal.rr.com> wrote in message

news:3D7687EF.9BA9683A@socal.rr.com… > If you have obstructional sleep apnea, it’s treatable.  So why would the

I cant believe you typed that. It is treatable for the MAJORITY but for some, like myself, it is not! — Friar Tuck was always the butt of Spoonerism Jokes from the Merry Men!

Response:

"Carl J." <c…@europa.lonestar.remove.org> wrote in message

news:slrnandb6b.aq0.carl@europa.lonestar.org… > In article <3D7687EF.9BA96…@socal.rr.com>, NormC wrote: > > If you have obstructional sleep apnea, it’s treatable. > Except when it’s not.  Seems like I’ve read a number of posts here from > people with apnea (OSA as well as CSA) where they just can’t get CPAP > to help.

Exactly! — Friar Tuck was always the butt of Spoonerism Jokes from the Merry Men!

Response:

"gregh" <s…@abuse.someone.else> wrote in message

news:ox0e9.2108$Sr6.71754@ozemail.com.au… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> "Lee Babcock" <leebabc…@pathcom.com> wrote in message > news:3D767715.EF1F0B88@pathcom.com… > > "Carl J." wrote: > > > Does anyone know of an actual case in the USA of someone getting SS > > > disability (or any disability) for Sleep Apnea?  It seems to me that > this > > > is a pretty important issue for some people here and it’s hard to > imagine > > > it being excluded. > > Carl….. I can’t imagine any situation where untreated sleep apnea > > could make you unemployable.  However, untreated long enough and you > Surely you have to be joking! I have to sleep in the afternoon. I can get > away with 1 or 2 afternoons in a row where I dont but my ability to work > after just 1 goes down a fair bit and after 2, a lot!

Just a PS to what I said above. After 1 afternoon, my heart rate has increased and after 2 it is beating erratically. Sleeping of a night, such that it is, does not fix this. I pushed it to 3 afternoons once and had to take the next 3 days off to get over it. I don’t know exactly what is happening to me at that stage but I know it reminds me of when I had a severely overactive thyroid and how that made my heart race. I still cant believe you typed that. "Uninformed" is too polite a word for that comment you made! — Friar Tuck was always the butt of Spoonerism Jokes from the Merry Men!

Response:

In article <3D767715.EF1F0…@pathcom.com>, Lee Babcock wrote: > "Carl J." wrote: >> Does anyone know of an actual case in the USA of someone getting SS >> disability (or any disability) for Sleep Apnea?  It seems to me that this >> is a pretty important issue for some people here and it’s hard to imagine >> it being excluded. > Carl….. I can’t imagine any situation where untreated sleep apnea > could make you unemployable.  

I’ve read lots of people’s unfortunate stories here about how untreated sleep apnea can make it quite hard to function (like this thread) and by reading such posts here I can "imagine" it very easily.   > However, untreated long enough and you > could end up with any number of health problems that could make you > unemployable.

True.  But in some cases CPAP simply doesn’t work for people and they don’t know about or their doctors can’t identify any other specific problems being involved.

Response:

In article <3D7687EF.9BA96…@socal.rr.com>, NormC wrote: > If you have obstructional sleep apnea, it’s treatable.  

Except when it’s not.  Seems like I’ve read a number of posts here from people with apnea (OSA as well as CSA) where they just can’t get CPAP to help. > So why would the > taxpayers want to make disability payments to someone with obstructional sleep > apnea.

Because they are for people with disabilities.  Sorry but I think you are off on a tangent here.  This discussion was not about the merits of SS disability qualifications for Americans.  You and I are not in charge of that after all. My question asked if anyone knew of *examples* of someone having apnea (*either* CSA or OSA) getting disability.  I bet that some people here (such as the original poster) would find that information pretty useful. > If you have other sleep disorders that are not so readily treatable, or not > treatble at all, such as central sleep apnea, then you could be a candidate > for SSD.

True, but this would include any disorder that someone cannot get treatment for or where the treatment does not help or work.

Response:

On Wed, 04 Sep 2002 17:11:49 -0400, Lee Babcock <leebabc…@pathcom.com> wrote: >Carl….. I can’t imagine any situation where untreated sleep apnea >could make you unemployable.  

Hypersomnia. — Visit Charlie’s Sneaker Pages: http://sneakers.pair.com/

Response:

On Wed, 04 Sep 2002 17:11:49 -0400, Lee Babcock <leebabc…@pathcom.com> wrote: >Carl….. I can’t imagine any situation where untreated sleep apnea >could make you unemployable.  

I read the newsletter that our company medical department puts out. They have had more than a few people who went in for a medical evaluation for work problems and had undiagnosed OSA. OSA treatment put them back to normal. — Visit Charlie’s Sneaker Pages: http://sneakers.pair.com/

Response:

"Carl J." <c…@europa.remove.lonestar.remove.org> wrote in message

news:slrnancnje.8nc.carl@europa.lonestar.org… > Does anyone know of an actual case in the USA of someone getting SS > disability (or any disability) for Sleep Apnea?  It seems to me that this > is a pretty important issue for some people here and it’s hard to imagine > it being excluded.

Going back to about 1995, yes I do. At that time – and obviously this may not apply now in any form – you could in SOME states. — Friar Tuck was always the butt of Spoonerism Jokes from the Merry Men!

Response:

"Lee Babcock" <leebabc…@pathcom.com> wrote in message

news:3D767715.EF1F0B88@pathcom.com… > "Carl J." wrote: > > Does anyone know of an actual case in the USA of someone getting SS > > disability (or any disability) for Sleep Apnea?  It seems to me that this > > is a pretty important issue for some people here and it’s hard to imagine > > it being excluded. > Carl….. I can’t imagine any situation where untreated sleep apnea > could make you unemployable.  However, untreated long enough and you

Surely you have to be joking! I have to sleep in the afternoon. I can get away with 1 or 2 afternoons in a row where I dont but my ability to work after just 1 goes down a fair bit and after 2, a lot! — Friar Tuck was always the butt of Spoonerism Jokes from the Merry Men!

Response:

If you have obstructional sleep apnea, it’s treatable.  So why would the taxpayers want to make disability payments to someone with obstructional sleep apnea. If you have other sleep disorders that are not so readily treatable, or not treatble at all, such as central sleep apnea, then you could be a candidate for SSD. Does anyone know of an actual case in the USA of someone getting SS disability (or any disability) for Sleep Apnea?  It seems to me that this is a pretty important issue for some people here and it’s hard to imagine it being excluded. In article <ir1bnuomsv4lhmso3pfbdr3rs6k2bjf…@4ax.com>, – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Zi…@World.Wide.Circus wrote: > For someone from Australia, you just described what it takes to get > approved for SSDI/SSI in the US very well. Good job. > Tal wrote: >>Greg……first – let me say, none of my doctors had anything to do with me >>getting disability really – on my recent review, my doc let me know how >>LITTLE he konws about cfs by putting on my form that the only problem cfs >>presents is tiredness…..that couldn’t be much further from the truth. >>So forget the whole doctor thing for now….and listen to what i have to say >>You DO NOT get approved for disability based on what particular illnesss you >>have!! The thing that gets you approved or rejected is how well you cope >>with dailiy activities!! >>I urge you to try again, if your docs won’t fill in the relevant forms, go >>to a different doc, but based on all the things you keep saying, i guarantee >>that if you persue this you will be approved.

Response:

FYI SSDI ===> Social Security Death Index (a database) SSD  ===> Social Security Disability SSI  ===> Supplemental Security Income Did you mean SSD…. or SSI? – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -c…@XschizoaffectiveX.org wrote: > SSDI pays so little that I can’t imagine someone really wanting to be > on it.  Some thing like $500 per month is all it pays. > On Wed, 04 Sep 2002 22:24:51 GMT, NormC <no…@socal.rr.com> wrote: > >If you have obstructional sleep apnea, it’s treatable.  So why would the > >taxpayers want to make disability payments to someone with obstructional sleep > >apnea. > >If you have other sleep disorders that are not so readily treatable, or not > >treatble at all, such as central sleep apnea, then you could be a candidate > >for SSD. > >Does anyone know of an actual case in the USA of someone getting SS > >disability (or any disability) for Sleep Apnea?  It seems to me that this > >is a pretty important issue for some people here and it’s hard to imagine > >it being excluded. > >In article <ir1bnuomsv4lhmso3pfbdr3rs6k2bjf…@4ax.com>, > >Zi…@World.Wide.Circus wrote: > >> For someone from Australia, you just described what it takes to get > >> approved for SSDI/SSI in the US very well. Good job. > >> Tal wrote: > >>>Greg……first – let me say, none of my doctors had anything to do with me > >>>getting disability really – on my recent review, my doc let me know how > >>>LITTLE he konws about cfs by putting on my form that the only problem cfs > >>>presents is tiredness…..that couldn’t be much further from the truth. > >>>So forget the whole doctor thing for now….and listen to what i have to say > >>>You DO NOT get approved for disability based on what particular illnesss you > >>>have!! The thing that gets you approved or rejected is how well you cope > >>>with dailiy activities!! > >>>I urge you to try again, if your docs won’t fill in the relevant forms, go > >>>to a different doc, but based on all the things you keep saying, i guarantee > >>>that if you persue this you will be approved.

Response:

Does anyone know of an actual case in the USA of someone getting SS disability (or any disability) for Sleep Apnea?  It seems to me that this is a pretty important issue for some people here and it’s hard to imagine it being excluded. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -In article <ir1bnuomsv4lhmso3pfbdr3rs6k2bjf…@4ax.com>, Zi…@World.Wide.Circus wrote: > For someone from Australia, you just described what it takes to get > approved for SSDI/SSI in the US very well. Good job. > Tal wrote: >>Greg……first – let me say, none of my doctors had anything to do with me >>getting disability really – on my recent review, my doc let me know how >>LITTLE he konws about cfs by putting on my form that the only problem cfs >>presents is tiredness…..that couldn’t be much further from the truth. >>So forget the whole doctor thing for now….and listen to what i have to say >>You DO NOT get approved for disability based on what particular illnesss you >>have!! The thing that gets you approved or rejected is how well you cope >>with dailiy activities!! >>I urge you to try again, if your docs won’t fill in the relevant forms, go >>to a different doc, but based on all the things you keep saying, i guarantee >>that if you persue this you will be approved.

Response:

"Carl J." wrote: > Does anyone know of an actual case in the USA of someone getting SS > disability (or any disability) for Sleep Apnea?  It seems to me that this > is a pretty important issue for some people here and it’s hard to imagine > it being excluded.

Carl….. I can’t imagine any situation where untreated sleep apnea could make you unemployable.  However, untreated long enough and you could end up with any number of health problems that could make you unemployable. What other health problems do you have? Regards Lee in Toronto —–= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =—– http://www.newsfeeds.com – The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! —–==  Over 80,000 Newsgroups – 16 Different Servers! =—–

Response:

hmm……wonder how he’d go sending me a ‘not’ … i did of course mean note — Beth in Australia =================== FAQ for alt.support.sleep-disorder can be found here http://www.anchorweb.com.au/sleepdisorders this site is a work in progress – feel free to submit info/articles

Response:

Greg….seems you’ve changed your email addy since we last corresponded, send me a not and i’ll email you back. I should add, that on the papers i’m going to send you, before lodging them i crossed out my response to the section about driving cause i didn’t want them to take my license away! — Beth in Australia =================== FAQ for alt.support.sleep-disorder can be found here http://www.anchorweb.com.au/sleepdisorders this site is a work in progress – feel free to submit info/articles

Response:

Beth – You are now doing what I would have done if I could!!!!  I hope he does what you say.  I agree (as best I can without nowing the Aussie system) with every doggone word you have written. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Tal wrote: > Greg……first – let me say, none of my doctors had anything to do with me > getting disability really – on my recent review, my doc let me know how > LITTLE he konws about cfs by putting on my form that the only problem cfs > presents is tiredness…..that couldn’t be much further from the truth. > So forget the whole doctor thing for now….and listen to what i have to say > You DO NOT get approved for disability based on what particular illnesss you > have!! The thing that gets you approved or rejected is how well you cope > with dailiy activities!! > I urge you to try again, if your docs won’t fill in the relevant forms, go > to a different doc, but based on all the things you keep saying, i guarantee > that if you persue this you will be approved. > When filling in the application forms, be honest about all the things you > can’t do, it’s hard to not want to present ourselves at our best, but what > you need to do is fill in the forms baring your worst days in mind, NOT your > best.  Be specific about the things you can do and why, ie, exhaustion > (abiltity to walk, stand, endurance etc), congnative difficulties > (inablility to think straight, difficulty remembering things, difficulty > expressing things in words etc), muscle weakness (inablility to lift heavy > objects, carry things etc) etc. don’t be general, be as specific as you > can. – i have copies of my last review papers which i’ll send you off-list > so you can see how I went about filling them out – they’re essentially the > same as the initial application.  My review has been approved twice now, > btw, and NOT on what the doc says, cause liek i mentioned above, all he did > is say i’m tired and woudln’t be able to show up to work every day. > Another important thing to remember, is to make sure they know that you > can’t do all required daily activities.  I mentioned that I often have to > have people help with housecleaning and sometimes have people cook meals for > me (if it ws the case then i’d have also mentioned that my mum has to help > me wash my own hair!)  i also probably mentioned that i can’t even manage to > take a shower every day because i have to reserve that energy to be able to > do soemthing else, like pick up a few groceries or whatever.  This stuff is > important to mention to the DHS doc if you have to see one.. have your wife > drive you to the appointment and mention that too. > WOrk hisory i think also plays a part, i believe that the fact that i’d only > been able to work part time/casual in the past few years and that I had had > to leave at least one job because of the illness worked in my favour…so > make sure they know you can’t work, and that you’ve been struggling to try > and work from home a few hours here and there just to be able to survive. > you have to give this a go greg, cause i KNOW if you go about it the right > way you WILL get approved.  whether or not you’ll be able to survive on the > pathetic amount of money they call the disability pension is another matter > entirely. > — > Beth in Australia > =================== > FAQ for alt.support.sleep-disorder can be found here > http://www.anchorweb.com.au/sleepdisorders > this site is a work in progress – feel free to submit info/articles > "gregh" <s…@abuse.someone.else> wrote in message > news:tadd9.1208$Sr6.43895@ozemail.com.au… > > "Tal" <beth…@hotmail.com> wrote in message > > news:akvi02$1lv840$1@ID-148111.news.dfncis.de… > > > > Cant work full time because of OSA – you who have been here since 1994 > > > when > > > > I started in the newsgroup, will know the OSA details to which I > refer. > > > > Cant get any form of Govt assistance so decided to try and work > properly > > > Greg, I really can’t understand this, on different occassions you’ve > > > mentioned that in addition to apnea, doctors have diagnosed you with at > > > least CFS and also MS – there’s NO WAY you can’t get govt disability > based > > > on that…. so if you’ve tried, try again, and make sure you do it > > right… > > > make sure they know what these docs have said and make sure they know > you > > > need help even to do day to day activities. > > Maybe you ought to go to doctors more recently then. I did. The simple > rule > > of thumb is: > > 1) Sleep Apnea doesn’t get anything. > > 2) The CFS I have would not be an issue if I didn’t have Sleep Apnea and > as > > the bulk of people can be treated for their sleep apnea and live > > normal/almost normal working lives, I don’t qualify even though it is > clear > > from medical records that my sleep apnea problem isn’t one that CAN be > > treated by anything around TODAY (that is to leave space for possible > future > > treatments I don’t yet know about). > > 3) MS I have is admittedly very low key right now. Eg, if it were MS only > > and no other health problem, there would be not a real lot of time I would > > have to have off work in any given year. Interestingly, I don’t get the > flu > > any longer and haven’t for years and I found out that many MS people have > > the same thing happen to them. Oddity! Anyway, I would likely have no more > > sick days than someone with the flu in any given year. > > So to be honest with you – there still remains no way in which I can > > actually GET any Govt assistance. However, I may be RUINED by the attempt. > > See, right now I am self employed and rely on my car to get me to jobs I > > have to do, wherever they may be as I do them at peoples’ homes and/or > > businesses. Without the car, I would not be able to get to most places as > > the cost would be prohibitive. I couldn’t walk the 10-20K some people are > > from any train station and as buses aren’t a big thing around here, the > only > > other alternative would be taxi from home to the railway as there is no > bus > > within 2K of me then train to the nearest station and taxi anything up to > > 20K from there. The gear I carry is heavy, too so even if a few Ks away > from > > the station, by the time I got there I would be wasted. Right now I can > pull > > up outside their house/business and cart the stuff inside. > > As to docs KNOWING I am in need of help, believe me they do but they > either > > are too lazy to do something (I believe this only of the GP I see who was > > the one who said "MS" to me which is why I keep going to him as he has > > proven he can see past the sleep apnea but is otherwise not a real helpful > > person) or are too antagonistic. I believe I have related the case of the > 3 > > neurologists before, the first wanting to deck me for saying "MRI" when he > > said "X-RAY" for something that had nothing to do with MS/Sleep Apnea/CFS > > and then the other 2 who knew I had been to the first. I have to wait a > few > > years and go to see someone entirely different and start from scratch – > > something the lazy GP told me he thought was in my best interests. I think > > that is a fair comment, too. So, I don’t have medical help and if I am too > > quick in trying to get it right now, I actually have neurologists, should > it > > come to me needing them – and it will – who will actively work AGAINST me > in > > order to keep the first neuro happy. > > I could say "such is life" but I am too angry for that. I could sue > perhaps > > but there would be no proof as you can well imagine. So, I am stuck where > I > > am, asking for ideas on ways I might be able to cut expenditure or > increase > > income that are possible for me. > > Beth I am no going to whinge endlessly about "how unfair it is" because I > > have done enough of that before. I just want some sage financial advice > from > > people in here who may be in a position to give it…..things that I can > > still achieve before it is too late. That’s all I want to ask from the > > readers in here. Until some years have passed I don’t have a snowball’s > > chance in Sydney of getting any medical payment assistance from the Govt > and > > the way the Feds are going, by the time I can they wont be giving much, if > > any, out anyway. > > — > > Friar Tuck was always the butt of Spoonerism Jokes from the Merry Men!

Response:

Greg……first – let me say, none of my doctors had anything to do with me getting disability really – on my recent review, my doc let me know how LITTLE he konws about cfs by putting on my form that the only problem cfs presents is tiredness…..that couldn’t be much further from the truth. So forget the whole doctor thing for now….and listen to what i have to say You DO NOT get approved for disability based on what particular illnesss you have!! The thing that gets you approved or rejected is how well you cope with dailiy activities!! I urge you to try again, if your docs won’t fill in the relevant forms, go to a different doc, but based on all the things you keep saying, i guarantee that if you persue this you will be approved. When filling in the application forms, be honest about all the things you can’t do, it’s hard to not want to present ourselves at our best, but what you need to do is fill in the forms baring your worst days in mind, NOT your best.  Be specific about the things you can do and why, ie, exhaustion (abiltity to walk, stand, endurance etc), congnative difficulties (inablility to think straight, difficulty remembering things, difficulty expressing things in words etc), muscle weakness (inablility to lift heavy objects, carry things etc) etc. don’t be general, be as specific as you can. – i have copies of my last review papers which i’ll send you off-list so you can see how I went about filling them out – they’re essentially the same as the initial application.  My review has been approved twice now, btw, and NOT on what the doc says, cause liek i mentioned above, all he did is say i’m tired and woudln’t be able to show up to work every day. Another important thing to remember, is to make sure they know that you can’t do all required daily activities.  I mentioned that I often have to have people help with housecleaning and sometimes have people cook meals for me (if it ws the case then i’d have also mentioned that my mum has to help me wash my own hair!)  i also probably mentioned that i can’t even manage to take a shower every day because i have to reserve that energy to be able to do soemthing else, like pick up a few groceries or whatever.  This stuff is important to mention to the DHS doc if you have to see one.. have your wife drive you to the appointment and mention that too. WOrk hisory i think also plays a part, i believe that the fact that i’d only been able to work part time/casual in the past few years and that I had had to leave at least one job because of the illness worked in my favour…so make sure they know you can’t work, and that you’ve been struggling to try and work from home a few hours here and there just to be able to survive. you have to give this a go greg, cause i KNOW if you go about it the right way you WILL get approved.  whether or not you’ll be able to survive on the pathetic amount of money they call the disability pension is another matter entirely. — Beth in Australia =================== FAQ for alt.support.sleep-disorder can be found here http://www.anchorweb.com.au/sleepdisorders this site is a work in progress – feel free to submit info/articles "gregh" <s…@abuse.someone.else> wrote in message

news:tadd9.1208$Sr6.43895@ozemail.com.au… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> "Tal" <beth…@hotmail.com> wrote in message > news:akvi02$1lv840$1@ID-148111.news.dfncis.de… > > > Cant work full time because of OSA – you who have been here since 1994 > > when > > > I started in the newsgroup, will know the OSA details to which I refer. > > > Cant get any form of Govt assistance so decided to try and work properly > > Greg, I really can’t understand this, on different occassions you’ve > > mentioned that in addition to apnea, doctors have diagnosed you with at > > least CFS and also MS – there’s NO WAY you can’t get govt disability based > > on that…. so if you’ve tried, try again, and make sure you do it > right… > > make sure they know what these docs have said and make sure they know you > > need help even to do day to day activities. > Maybe you ought to go to doctors more recently then. I did. The simple rule > of thumb is: > 1) Sleep Apnea doesn’t get anything. > 2) The CFS I have would not be an issue if I didn’t have Sleep Apnea and as > the bulk of people can be treated for their sleep apnea and live > normal/almost normal working lives, I don’t qualify even though it is clear > from medical records that my sleep apnea problem isn’t one that CAN be > treated by anything around TODAY (that is to leave space for possible future > treatments I don’t yet know about). > 3) MS I have is admittedly very low key right now. Eg, if it were MS only > and no other health problem, there would be not a real lot of time I would > have to have off work in any given year. Interestingly, I don’t get the flu > any longer and haven’t for years and I found out that many MS people have > the same thing happen to them. Oddity! Anyway, I would likely have no more > sick days than someone with the flu in any given year. > So to be honest with you – there still remains no way in which I can > actually GET any Govt assistance. However, I may be RUINED by the attempt. > See, right now I am self employed and rely on my car to get me to jobs I > have to do, wherever they may be as I do them at peoples’ homes and/or > businesses. Without the car, I would not be able to get to most places as > the cost would be prohibitive. I couldn’t walk the 10-20K some people are > from any train station and as buses aren’t a big thing around here, the only > other alternative would be taxi from home to the railway as there is no bus > within 2K of me then train to the nearest station and taxi anything up to > 20K from there. The gear I carry is heavy, too so even if a few Ks away from > the station, by the time I got there I would be wasted. Right now I can pull > up outside their house/business and cart the stuff inside. > As to docs KNOWING I am in need of help, believe me they do but they either > are too lazy to do something (I believe this only of the GP I see who was > the one who said "MS" to me which is why I keep going to him as he has > proven he can see past the sleep apnea but is otherwise not a real helpful > person) or are too antagonistic. I believe I have related the case of the 3 > neurologists before, the first wanting to deck me for saying "MRI" when he > said "X-RAY" for something that had nothing to do with MS/Sleep Apnea/CFS > and then the other 2 who knew I had been to the first. I have to wait a few > years and go to see someone entirely different and start from scratch – > something the lazy GP told me he thought was in my best interests. I think > that is a fair comment, too. So, I don’t have medical help and if I am too > quick in trying to get it right now, I actually have neurologists, should it > come to me needing them – and it will – who will actively work AGAINST me in > order to keep the first neuro happy. > I could say "such is life" but I am too angry for that. I could sue perhaps > but there would be no proof as you can well imagine. So, I am stuck where I > am, asking for ideas on ways I might be able to cut expenditure or increase > income that are possible for me. > Beth I am no going to whinge endlessly about "how unfair it is" because I > have done enough of that before. I just want some sage financial advice from > people in here who may be in a position to give it…..things that I can > still achieve before it is too late. That’s all I want to ask from the > readers in here. Until some years have passed I don’t have a snowball’s > chance in Sydney of getting any medical payment assistance from the Govt and > the way the Feds are going, by the time I can they wont be giving much, if > any, out anyway. > — > Friar Tuck was always the butt of Spoonerism Jokes from the Merry Men!

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -gregh wrote: > "NormC" <no…@socal.rr.com> wrote in message > news:3D73B1BF.7BA321CE@socal.rr.com… > > Gregh – Almost two years ago, you and Patrick Richards both posted your > > serious health and income problems at about the same time. > > If you recall, I offered to help, because of my own similar experiences. > > Patrick’s case was clear to me; however, yours wasn’t.  When I tried to > get > > additional information from you, I said something that you didn’t like… > > and Beth joined you in bashing me. > Norm, > I know your screen/newsgroup name but if you expect me to recall what > happened 2 years ago in a newsgroup except in a general sort of sense, you > dont know untreated sleep apnea! I have actually made the effort on more > than one occasion to remember specific details of one event or another and I > tell you I can get there, still but the effort drains me so generally > speaking, I let the "delete" enzyme do it’s thing!

Well, it was a special event for me <g>… so I remember it.  But I sure know what you mean. > > I believe that I was, and am, of significant help to Patrick, continung up > > to today in his second round with the doctor’s letters to those of > > importance (insurance companies, government agencies, etc.).  Even though > > it has become clear to me that you do need help, because of your living in > > Oz, I haven’t really had much in the way of ideas.  However, Beth’s > > response to your post, below, has caused me to re-offer my help. > > However, your response to her post is very important to my being able to > > help. > Believe me when I say I don’t have a clue what you mean in that last > sentence, thus invalidating anything I thought made sense to me in the > preceding paragraph. Sorry about that.

What I should have said was, "Your response to her post is very important to my being able to decide if I can help."  Having read your response, I have no ideas  whatsoever.  Sorry. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> I didn’t get to sleep yesterday > afternoon because of the 17 year old son of a customer I saw yesterday > morning who took it upon himself to look inside his computer and blamed me > for the mess he created, easily fixed by me at no income because it isn’t > something I could have proven at any stage one way or another. Still spiting > chips about that as he told me I was an idiot for laying his computer on > it’s side (computer was off) to extract the dead modem and put in a working > one. Dickhead doesn’t know squat and was telling ME I know nothing. Sure. I > fixed all the crap he had caused, told him I knew he had done it and if he > plays around inside the computer again – this in earshot of the mother – he > would be PAYING for the fix next time. No apologies, either. ARGH! Oh and I > NEED my afternoon sleep so today I made sure I didn’t have an appointment to > do (usually make them at night) and am taking the time to rest so I can get > on with working. Still – a whole day with no income is not good but the > mistakes I may make if I tried to work like I am now would end up costing > more! > — > Friar Tuck was always the butt of Spoonerism Jokes from the Merry Men!

Response:

"NormC" <no…@socal.rr.com> wrote in message

news:3D73B1BF.7BA321CE@socal.rr.com… > Gregh – Almost two years ago, you and Patrick Richards both posted your > serious health and income problems at about the same time. > If you recall, I offered to help, because of my own similar experiences. > Patrick’s case was clear to me; however, yours wasn’t.  When I tried to get > additional information from you, I said something that you didn’t like… > and Beth joined you in bashing me.

Norm, I know your screen/newsgroup name but if you expect me to recall what happened 2 years ago in a newsgroup except in a general sort of sense, you dont know untreated sleep apnea! I have actually made the effort on more than one occasion to remember specific details of one event or another and I tell you I can get there, still but the effort drains me so generally speaking, I let the "delete" enzyme do it’s thing! > I believe that I was, and am, of significant help to Patrick, continung up > to today in his second round with the doctor’s letters to those of > importance (insurance companies, government agencies, etc.).  Even though > it has become clear to me that you do need help, because of your living in > Oz, I haven’t really had much in the way of ideas.  However, Beth’s > response to your post, below, has caused me to re-offer my help. > However, your response to her post is very important to my being able to > help.

Believe me when I say I don’t have a clue what you mean in that last sentence, thus invalidating anything I thought made sense to me in the preceding paragraph. Sorry about that. I didn’t get to sleep yesterday afternoon because of the 17 year old son of a customer I saw yesterday morning who took it upon himself to look inside his computer and blamed me for the mess he created, easily fixed by me at no income because it isn’t something I could have proven at any stage one way or another. Still spiting chips about that as he told me I was an idiot for laying his computer on it’s side (computer was off) to extract the dead modem and put in a working one. Dickhead doesn’t know squat and was telling ME I know nothing. Sure. I fixed all the crap he had caused, told him I knew he had done it and if he plays around inside the computer again – this in earshot of the mother – he would be PAYING for the fix next time. No apologies, either. ARGH! Oh and I NEED my afternoon sleep so today I made sure I didn’t have an appointment to do (usually make them at night) and am taking the time to rest so I can get on with working. Still – a whole day with no income is not good but the mistakes I may make if I tried to work like I am now would end up costing more! — Friar Tuck was always the butt of Spoonerism Jokes from the Merry Men!

Response:

"Tal" <beth…@hotmail.com> wrote in message

news:akvi02$1lv840$1@ID-148111.news.dfncis.de… > > Cant work full time because of OSA – you who have been here since 1994 > when > > I started in the newsgroup, will know the OSA details to which I refer. > > Cant get any form of Govt assistance so decided to try and work properly > Greg, I really can’t understand this, on different occassions you’ve > mentioned that in addition to apnea, doctors have diagnosed you with at > least CFS and also MS – there’s NO WAY you can’t get govt disability based > on that…. so if you’ve tried, try again, and make sure you do it right… > make sure they know what these docs have said and make sure they know you > need help even to do day to day activities.

Maybe you ought to go to doctors more recently then. I did. The simple rule of thumb is: 1) Sleep Apnea doesn’t get anything. 2) The CFS I have would not be an issue if I didn’t have Sleep Apnea and as the bulk of people can be treated for their sleep apnea and live normal/almost normal working lives, I don’t qualify even though it is clear from medical records that my sleep apnea problem isn’t one that CAN be treated by anything around TODAY (that is to leave space for possible future treatments I don’t yet know about). 3) MS I have is admittedly very low key right now. Eg, if it were MS only and no other health problem, there would be not a real lot of time I would have to have off work in any given year. Interestingly, I don’t get the flu any longer and haven’t for years and I found out that many MS people have the same thing happen to them. Oddity! Anyway, I would likely have no more sick days than someone with the flu in any given year. So to be honest with you – there still remains no way in which I can actually GET any Govt assistance. However, I may be RUINED by the attempt. See, right now I am self employed and rely on my car to get me to jobs I have to do, wherever they may be as I do them at peoples’ homes and/or businesses. Without the car, I would not be able to get to most places as the cost would be prohibitive. I couldn’t walk the 10-20K some people are from any train station and as buses aren’t a big thing around here, the only other alternative would be taxi from home to the railway as there is no bus within 2K of me then train to the nearest station and taxi anything up to 20K from there. The gear I carry is heavy, too so even if a few Ks away from the station, by the time I got there I would be wasted. Right now I can pull up outside their house/business and cart the stuff inside. As to docs KNOWING I am in need of help, believe me they do but they either are too lazy to do something (I believe this only of the GP I see who was the one who said "MS" to me which is why I keep going to him as he has proven he can see past the sleep apnea but is otherwise not a real helpful person) or are too antagonistic. I believe I have related the case of the 3 neurologists before, the first wanting to deck me for saying "MRI" when he said "X-RAY" for something that had nothing to do with MS/Sleep Apnea/CFS and then the other 2 who knew I had been to the first. I have to wait a few years and go to see someone entirely different and start from scratch – something the lazy GP told me he thought was in my best interests. I think that is a fair comment, too. So, I don’t have medical help and if I am too quick in trying to get it right now, I actually have neurologists, should it come to me needing them – and it will – who will actively work AGAINST me in order to keep the first neuro happy. I could say "such is life" but I am too angry for that. I could sue perhaps but there would be no proof as you can well imagine. So, I am stuck where I am, asking for ideas on ways I might be able to cut expenditure or increase income that are possible for me. Beth I am no going to whinge endlessly about "how unfair it is" because I have done enough of that before. I just want some sage financial advice from people in here who may be in a position to give it…..things that I can still achieve before it is too late. That’s all I want to ask from the readers in here. Until some years have passed I don’t have a snowball’s chance in Sydney of getting any medical payment assistance from the Govt and the way the Feds are going, by the time I can they wont be giving much, if any, out anyway. — Friar Tuck was always the butt of Spoonerism Jokes from the Merry Men!

Response:

Cant work full time because of OSA – you who have been here since 1994 when I started in the newsgroup, will know the OSA details to which I refer. Cant get any form of Govt assistance so decided to try and work properly anyway but that wasn’t possible so started my own business, self employed doing anything and everything to do with computers excepting I am no "Bob the Builder" by a long shot so am not going to go ripping walls apart to lay cabling – not that it really is an issue now. Been doing that about 2 years now and took some time today to reflect on what it was like this time a year ago and went back through my records. Apparently about the same as it is now. Very quiet, not much incoming money but that will change in about 2 months for about 4 months. The fact is that if it were not for the "line of credit" style housing loan I have, we would long ago have been on the streets and with the available credit I have and if everything else, bills and income etc, remain status quo, in about 2 years I actually WILL be on the streets. Because of the business I do, I claim internet connection bills for my business which is why I can be here whinging like this. I wasn’t really up to trying to figure all this out today but tried my best to think of ways out of this. Some small changes came to mind and are now implemented but they really don’t mean much. The fact is that the only major thing that would make any difference is for me to do exactly as the doctors told me would happen by 50 and kark it. Never been a quitter and so didn’t believe – and still don’t – that their quackery rules. I will still have OSA by 50 (less than 3 years away) and it doesn’t get better untreated as it is for me but dying? Not likely unless I am stupid and exercise hard which IS likely, given my lack of oxygen to cause a problem. Then it was obvious – I don’t have kids but I have a house, car, 2 dogs and wife to consider, my wife travelling around 2.5 hours each day each way to work so near 6 hours (and actually more if there is some hold-up) or quarter of the day in transit. If I actually DO kark it, the life insurance I have covers the housing bill and she can at least start saving some money. There must be a better answer though. Anyone been in this position and gotten out of it even though your medical problem didn’t actually get better? Any ideas welcome. Ta! — Friar Tuck was always the butt of Spoonerism Jokes from the Merry Men!

Response:

> Cant work full time because of OSA – you who have been here since 1994 when > I started in the newsgroup, will know the OSA details to which I refer. > Cant get any form of Govt assistance so decided to try and work properly

Greg, I really can’t understand this, on different occassions you’ve mentioned that in addition to apnea, doctors have diagnosed you with at least CFS and also MS – there’s NO WAY you can’t get govt disability based on that…. so if you’ve tried, try again, and make sure you do it right… make sure they know what these docs have said and make sure they know you need help even to do day to day activities. — Beth in Australia =================== FAQ for alt.support.sleep-disorder can be found here http://www.anchorweb.com.au/sleepdisorders this site is a work in progress – feel free to submit info/articles

Response:

Gregh – Almost two years ago, you and Patrick Richards both posted your serious health and income problems at about the same time.   If you recall, I offered to help, because of my own similar experiences. Patrick’s case was clear to me; however, yours wasn’t.  When I tried to get additional information from you, I said something that you didn’t like… and Beth joined you in bashing me. I believe that I was, and am, of significant help to Patrick, continung up to today in his second round with the doctor’s letters to those of importance (insurance companies, government agencies, etc.).  Even though it has become clear to me that you do need help, because of your living in Oz, I haven’t really had much in the way of ideas.  However, Beth’s response to your post, below, has caused me to re-offer my help. However, your response to her post is very important to my being able to help. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -gregh wrote: > Cant work full time because of OSA – you who have been here since 1994 when > I started in the newsgroup, will know the OSA details to which I refer. > Cant get any form of Govt assistance so decided to try and work properly > anyway but that wasn’t possible so started my own business, self employed > doing anything and everything to do with computers excepting I am no "Bob > the Builder" by a long shot so am not going to go ripping walls apart to lay > cabling – not that it really is an issue now. Been doing that about 2 years > now and took some time today to reflect on what it was like this time a year > ago and went back through my records. Apparently about the same as it is > now. Very quiet, not much incoming money but that will change in about 2 > months for about 4 months. The fact is that if it were not for the "line of > credit" style housing loan I have, we would long ago have been on the > streets and with the available credit I have and if everything else, bills > and income etc, remain status quo, in about 2 years I actually WILL be on > the streets. Because of the business I do, I claim internet connection bills > for my business which is why I can be here whinging like this. I wasn’t > really up to trying to figure all this out today but tried my best to think > of ways out of this. Some small changes came to mind and are now implemented > but they really don’t mean much. The fact is that the only major thing that > would make any difference is for me to do exactly as the doctors told me > would happen by 50 and kark it. Never been a quitter and so didn’t believe – > and still don’t – that their quackery rules. I will still have OSA by 50 > (less than 3 years away) and it doesn’t get better untreated as it is for me > but dying? Not likely unless I am stupid and exercise hard which IS likely, > given my lack of oxygen to cause a problem. Then it was obvious – I don’t > have kids but I have a house, car, 2 dogs and wife to consider, my wife > travelling around 2.5 hours each day each way to work so near 6 hours (and > actually more if there is some hold-up) or quarter of the day in transit. If > I actually DO kark it, the life insurance I have covers the housing bill and > she can at least start saving some money. There must be a better answer > though. Anyone been in this position and gotten out of it even though your > medical problem didn’t actually get better? Any ideas welcome. Ta! > — > Friar Tuck was always the butt of Spoonerism Jokes from the Merry Men!

Response:

Question…

Question:

"Danny" <dcat…@webtv.net> wrote in message

news:8273-3D3C80D3-363@storefull-2231.public.lawson.webtv.net… > I often wake up and find that I am unable to move. I am concious and can > hear, but I can’t even open my eyes. Can anyone out there tell me why > this happens, or perhaps what exactly is happening? > Thanks in advance, > Danny

It is a symptom of narcolepsy.  Everyone is "paralized" during REM — it keeps us from acting out our dreams.  Some people wake up, but are still in this state.  What you are experiencing is "Sleep paralysis."  You can read all about it at: http://www-med.stanford.edu/school/Psychiatry/narcolepsy/symptoms.html Hope this is some help. JenniO

Response:

dcat…@webtv.net (Danny) wrote: >I often wake up and find that I am unable to move. I am concious and can >hear, but I can’t even open my eyes. Can anyone out there tell me why >this happens, or perhaps what exactly is happening?

It sounds like sleep paralysis, it can be scary, but it’s usually nothing to worry about. Some people are able to bring themselves out of it by rapidly flicking their eyes back and forth, try it and let us know if it works for you. http://abcnews.go.com/sections/living/DailyNews/sleepparalysis990411…. Tom

Response:

Hi Danny! Sounds like you should make an appointment with a sleep Dr.  I’m no expert but I have a sleep disorder called idiopathic Hypersomnia and on a recent mission to obtain more info on my condition I recall reading something about your problem. If it’s available to you, try about.com and look up sleep disorders. I hope this is helpful to you and good luck! You should still check with either your regular phys. or see a sllep specialist. Danny wrote in message

<8273-3D3C80D3-…@storefull-2231.public.lawson.webtv.net>… I often wake up and find that I am unable to move. I am concious and can hear, but I can’t even open my eyes. Can anyone out there tell me why this happens, or perhaps what exactly is happening? Thanks in advance, Danny

Response:

I often wake up and find that I am unable to move. I am concious and can hear, but I can’t even open my eyes. Can anyone out there tell me why this happens, or perhaps what exactly is happening? Thanks in advance, Danny

Response:

Provigil/Idiopathic Hypersomnia

Question:

Hello! Since reading the many posts here I have noticed that there are quite a few people on Provigil to help maintain their sleep disorders. I, too am on Provigil 200mg, 2 x’s a day. I was on Ritalin in the beginning and it worked great for approx. 1 year and then I had an S.V.T. attack.(super ventricular tachicardia)(heart rate 200bpm) According to the heart speacilist the attack was caused by the ritalin. Since then, approx 2 years ago, I have been on the provigil. I still have mild attacks of rapid heart beats up to 180-190 lasting from 2 to 5 min. The Dr. said that provigil was my last hope yet it seems to not work so good for me. I can take it and still sleep. The little research I was able to find on it says it can cause heart arythmias too. I would like to know if anyone knows the outcome of long term usage on this particular drug? Thanks Again! SleepyBme

Response:

SleepyBme wrote: > Hello! > Since reading the many posts here I have noticed that there are quite a few > people on Provigil to help maintain their sleep disorders. I, too am on > Provigil 200mg, 2 x’s a day. I was on Ritalin in the beginning and it worked > great for approx. 1 year and then I had an S.V.T. attack.(super ventricular > tachicardia)(heart rate 200bpm) According to the heart speacilist the attack > was caused by the ritalin. Since then, approx 2 years ago, I have been on > the provigil. I still have mild attacks of rapid heart beats up to 180-190 > lasting from 2 to 5 min. The Dr. said that provigil was my last hope yet it > seems to not work so good for me. I can take it and still sleep. The little > research I was able to find on it says it can cause heart arythmias too. I > would like to know if anyone knows the outcome of long term usage on this > particular drug? Thanks Again! SleepyBme

FWIW, four weeks ago my neurologist sleep doc said there are no long term studies on Provigil, and the only appropriate long term use is for narcolepsy, the illness Provigil was developed to treat.

Response:

Can Margrove explain this?

Question:

My psych says I’m not bipolar, but there are several bipolars on my father’s side of the family. So I might have some genetic tendencies in this direction.

it may be worth a trial of lithium carb 300mg a day for a week or two blood serum levels below .8 ng/ml you mentioned having to use despiramine to jump start a depression as well you may have some borderline bipolar slow cycles happening that may bear looking into-if this is indeed an atypical depression you may do better on mood stabilizers at very low doses or trying an maoi instead of the zoloft or using desipramine at subclinical doses to acheive around 50-100 ng/ml and seeing if this cycling stops-or you could pinch Charla. I understand this has fewer side effects LM

Response:

My psych says I’m not bipolar, but there are several bipolars on my father’s side of the family. So I might have some genetic tendencies in this direction. it may be worth a trial of lithium carb 300mg a day for a week or two blood serum levels below .8 ng/ml

I got up to 300 mg/day of lithium carb about 4 years ago to augment Zoloft 200 mg/day for a bout of depression. The lithium really zonked me out, disoriented me, and I couldn’t remember words I wanted to use when speaking. So I stopped lithium. That’s when my psych added the desipramine, eventually ending up on a dose of 50 mg/day, which caused complete resolution of the depression in about 2 weeks. you mentioned having to use despiramine to jump start a depression as well you may have some borderline bipolar slow cycles happening that may bear looking into-

My psychiatrist said I wasn’t bipolar. In fact I don’t meet the criteria for either mania or hypomania in the DSM-IV. I do tend to get mildly elated after coming out of a depression. Very similar to getting mildly elated after buying a new car (Mercedes are the best). if this is indeed an atypical depression you may do better on mood stabilizers at very low doses or trying an maoi instead of the zoloft or using desipramine at subclinical doses to acheive around 50-100 ng/ml and seeing if this cycling stops

The "cycling" in not common. Usually mild elation after coming out of a depression. Maybe once every 3 or 4 years. -or you could pinch Charla. Yes. I think that would pick up her spirits! It would make her jump too! I understand this has fewer side effects

Only if you don’t consider getting clobbered with a right hook a side effect. LM

Chip

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – psychiatrist was unable to explain why I had become depressed, what were the symptoms of your perceived depression? did you have any testing done to determine the extent of this feeling or if it was a documentable depresive syndrome or a discontinuation syndrome from decreasing and exiting serum and protein levels of active clonazepam. If the benzo makes you feel better and you stop it then its emotionally deactivatng characteristics cease and you feel things you may find uncomfortable. People on benzos that work, when stopped find they feel badly. It isn’t so much antidepressant effect of the med, but a relief of ones tension, anxiety, agitation, rumination, dissociation, focus, sleep changes which can make one feel depressed, lots of factors. Many times removal of a medication that helps one feel more in control, makes one feel out of control-either because the med works, which in your case is evident it does, or because the discontinuation is uncomfortable and causes a sense of despondency, turmoil, blandness, innervated, etc. It doesn’t surprise me. Because you rebounded so rapidly it could very well be a combination of discontinuation and return of agitation and dread-there is also some evidence that sertraline levels become slightly elevated with the combo so this could also be contributory when alprazolam first came out my collegues jumped at the premarketing disclosure that it acted as an antidepressant for mild symptoms. My take then, and now is that it packs such an active wallop in aborting and reducing anxiety and panic that the relief from this torture is relief of a reactive depressive stimuli. Klonopin shares similar antipanic capabilities although slower in onset or its just one of those things that remains a mystery-like stone henge LM

I think it’s a combination of all the things you mentioned – maybe leaning on the last :) As a teen and after years of taking white pills (have no idea what they were) for "spells", I had my first experience with 10 mg. of Valium. It was at a hospital and, as you might imagine, I wasn’t in great shape. In 20 minutes or so, my mind cleared, I felt calm, focused and wide-awake. Very surprising to the doctors who expected sedation and a ride home in the back seat for me. In reality, I alertly drove home myself, watched some TV, went to bed and had a great nights sleep. —–=  Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News  =—– http://www.newsfeeds.com – The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World!  Check out our new Unlimited Server. No Download or Time Limits! —–==  Over 80,000 Newsgroups – 19 Different Servers!  ==—–

Response:

psychiatrist was unable to explain why I had become depressed, what were the symptoms of your perceived depression?

felt depressed, lack of interest in anything, hypersomnia, had a PA on the freeway for the first time in years which started some phobic avoidance behavior, fatigue, aching in anterior thighs, no energy, slight agitation, carbohydrate craving, depersonalization which responded in minutes to 0.5 mg of Xanax, diminished concertration did you have any testing done to determine the extent of this feeling

No or if it was a documentable depresive syndrome or a discontinuation syndrome from decreasing and exiting serum and protein levels of active clonazepam.

The Klonopin taper was over a period of about 4 to 5 months…slow…I wanted to know if it was doing anything, so I withdrew from Klonopin. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – If the benzo makes you feel better and you stop it then its emotionally deactivatng characteristics cease and you feel things you may find uncomfortable. People on benzos that work, when stopped find they feel badly. It isn’t so much antidepressant effect of the med, but a relief of ones tension, anxiety, agitation, rumination, dissociation, focus, sleep changes which can make one feel depressed, lots of factors. Many times removal of a medication that helps one feel more in control, makes one feel out of control-either because the med works, which in your case is evident it does, or because the discontinuation is uncomfortable and causes a sense of despondency, turmoil, blandness, innervated, etc. It doesn’t surprise me. Because you rebounded so rapidly it could very well be a combination of discontinuation and return of agitation and dread-there is also some evidence that sertraline levels become slightly elevated with the combo so this could also be contributory when alprazolam first came out my collegues jumped at the premarketing disclosure that it acted as an antidepressant for mild symptoms. My take then, and now is that it packs such an active wallop in aborting and reducing anxiety and panic that the relief from this torture is relief of a reactive depressive stimuli. Klonopin shares similar antipanic capabilities although slower in onset or its just one of those things that remains a mystery-like stone henge

My psychiatrist said that physical withdrawal from Klonopin occurs (if it is going to occur) at about 2 weeks after decreasing a dose. I never noted anything specific happening at the two week time frame. I have often wondered if I had some sort of discontinutation syndrome since I had been on the Klonopin for about 12 years, and my depression and anxiety and mild agitation and depersonalization responded so favorably with 1 to 2 days after resuming the original dose of Klonopin from which I had tapered (I believe it was 2 mg/day). LM

Chip

Response:

wondered if I had some sort of discontinutation syndrome since I had been on the Klonopin for about 12 years, and my depression and anxiety and mild agitation and depersonalization responded so favorably with 1 to 2 days the telling sign is the aches and pains especially in the legs (back is another area)

Not pain, but aching in the anterior thighs. I get this when I have atypical depression. I didn’t get the widespread muscle pains and twitches that my psychiatrist said were a sign of Klonopin withdrawal. and the rapid response to the xanax in zapping the depersonalization. (very quietly I add so the anti benzo boobs don’t get woodies) there is some tissue saturation and liver saturation with benzos that cleaves and falls apart sometime after the official weaning process so some little twinges of discomfort hyper or hypo somnia feelings of lethargy and apathy can occur for a period about 3-6 weeks after your last dose.

I get hypersomnia of a component of my atypical depression. I can get it even when I am not decreasing my dose of Klonopin. I’m sure I had a relapse of my atypical depression. I’ve had depression enough times to recognize it when it recurs. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Since you are apparently hypersensitive to discomfort and the medication itself this is a good bet that what you felt was an occurence of discontinuation with some old habits and sensations of the part of your illness that was quieted and supressed. You may need this type of med to sequester these symptoms indefinetly or until your chemical makeup changes if ever, over time and with ageing. remember clonazepam is highly metabolized so it very effective in getting to your brain and everywhere else for that matter-so your body gets acustomed to its presence and has much work to do to reset its own go-no go- transmitter receptors-this takes energy, carbs, sleep, and makes you feel crappy

Also when I restarted the Klonopin, I not only came out of my depression, but had a slight overshoot into mild elation that lasted 2 to 3 weeks until I became stable (not depressed, and not elated). I usually get mildly elated for a few weeks when I come out of a depression. My psych says I’m not bipolar, but there are several bipolars on my father’s side of the family. So I might have some genetic tendencies in this direction. LM

Chip

Response:

psychiatrist was unable to explain why I had become depressed,

what were the symptoms of your perceived depression? did you have any testing done to determine the extent of this feeling or if it was a documentable depresive syndrome or a discontinuation syndrome from decreasing and exiting serum and protein levels of active clonazepam. If the benzo makes you feel better and you stop it then its emotionally deactivatng characteristics cease and you feel things you may find uncomfortable. People on benzos that work, when stopped find they feel badly. It isn’t so much antidepressant effect of the med, but a relief of ones tension, anxiety, agitation, rumination, dissociation, focus, sleep changes which can make one feel depressed, lots of factors. Many times removal of a medication that helps one feel more in control, makes one feel out of control-either because the med works, which in your case is evident it does, or because the discontinuation is uncomfortable and causes a sense of despondency, turmoil, blandness, innervated, etc. It doesn’t surprise me. Because you rebounded so rapidly it could very well be a combination of discontinuation and return of agitation and dread-there is also some evidence that sertraline levels become slightly elevated with the combo so this could also be contributory when alprazolam first came out my collegues jumped at the premarketing disclosure that it acted as an antidepressant for mild symptoms. My take then, and now is that it packs such an active wallop in aborting and reducing anxiety and panic that the relief from this torture is relief of a reactive depressive stimuli. Klonopin shares similar antipanic capabilities although slower in onset or its just one of those things that remains a mystery-like stone henge LM

Response:

wondered if I had some sort of discontinutation syndrome since I had been on the Klonopin for about 12 years, and my depression and anxiety and mild agitation and depersonalization responded so favorably with 1 to 2 days

the telling sign is the aches and pains especially in the legs (back is another area) and the rapid response to the xanax in zapping the depersonalization. (very quietly I add so the anti benzo boobs don’t get woodies) there is some tissue saturation and liver saturation with benzos that cleaves and falls apart sometime after the official weaning process so some little twinges of discomfort hyper or hypo somnia feelings of lethargy and apathy can occur for a period about 3-6 weeks after your last dose. Since you are apparently hypersensitive to discomfort and the medication itself this is a good bet that what you felt was an occurence of discontinuation with some old habits and sensations of the part of your illness that was quieted and supressed. You may need this type of med to sequester these symptoms indefinetly or until your chemical makeup changes if ever, over time and with ageing. remember clonazepam is highly metabolized so it very effective in getting to your brain and everywhere else for that matter-so your body gets acustomed to its presence and has much work to do to reset its own go-no go- transmitter receptors-this takes energy, carbs, sleep, and makes you feel crappy LM

Response:

While remaining on Zoloft 100 mg/day, I tapered off Klonopin 3 mg/day about 3 years ago, at the rate of a 0.5 mg/day decrease every one month till I got down to .5 mg/day, and then I went to .25 mg/day for a month and then off completely. I had been on Klonopin for about 12 years at that time. I became progressively more depressed (and anxious) as the taper proceeded, but had no physical withdrawal symptoms. After I had been off the Klonopin completely for one full month, I restarted taking Klonopin at 2 or 3 mg/day (forget) and the depression completely resolved in 1 or 2 days! My psychiatrist was unable to explain why I had become depressed, or why the Klonopin made the depression resolve so rapidly. Have you ever heard a similar story? Any possible explanations for my above experience? Thanks, Chip

Response: